I bought 2 Japanese Princesses and 1 Mayday at a nursery a few months ago. My large 2gallon Japanese Princess is starting to look like a Mayday? And my smaller sizes both look like Japanese Princess, one was supposed to be a small Mayday. I have a small Mystic Mikawa but that looks like it was labeled correctly.
Good morning Connor , first of all 'so so jealous'. Can't get them over this side of the pond. Secondly, identification with these Mikawa's I feel is very difficult in their early days of leafing out. And tbh I have seen a few mature ones at Mr Maple online and they are so very close to each other in leaf. But mistakes do happen at the best of nurseries and so I would allow a little bit longer for ID.
Since Conner hasn't responded here is a link where he shows the trees and on next page answers where he purchased. Gossler Nursery in Springfield Japanese Maple in Full Sun
I assumed so, but wanted to make sure. The prices seemed cheap for Gossler. Their one gallon Mikawa’s tend to go for 100.00. So a 2 gallon JP for 80 seemed too good to be true. Thank you for answering my question!
Yeah they really bumped up the prices in the last year!!!! Best deal I ever found was Yuki Yama welsh pots for $25 from Sam the Maple Lady. :)
Acerholic, I will share my humble opinion that I usually keep to myself, but since it might actually help someone (in this case, to soothe your jealousy), I am here to let you know that Mystic Mikawa, Japanese Princess, and Mayday are overrated and you're not missing much. OK wait - before the pitchforks and torches come out - I did say it's just my opinion! :) I have passed on all three of these on multiple occasions, including some really full 3 gal JP in 2022, and one of the first available Mystic Mikawas in the mid 2010s when I was visiting Matt and Tim at MrMaple. (Honestly, I only regret not buying that one because it would be a nice sized specimen by now, but only mild regret). But anyhow, my point is that these three cultivars are different from Mikawa yatsubusa only as they're leafing out, and then they're just a Mikawa yatsubusa the entire rest of the year. Of course there's nothing wrong with having "just another Mikawa yatsubusa"! It is in my top 3 cultivars of all time list just like pretty much everyone else. And there's also nothing wrong with geeking out over a maple cultivar just to enjoy its uniqueness for only two or three weeks in the entire year. Just letting you know how little you're missing out on... in my opinion. I am aware that there are some other Mikawa variants out there, but I have little or no experience with them. Perhaps some of them will retain their unique characteristics longer than these three do. I'll also say that the experience with these might differ a bit in the cooler PNW than here in NC where they green up very quickly. My 2c worth and it's OK if you find that it is not even worth that much. KN
That is a brilliant posting and one that I hope many will read and appreciate your thoughts on these cultivars. It is in the real world that we learn about how a maple looks throughout all the seasons and not just the hype of growers. So IMO that was an excellent 2c worth @kines
I 100% respectfully disagree with you. Mine look nothing like OG Mikawa after spring. They continue to push color on top of the greens for the entire growing season.. They even take on a white bleached look during the summer with pinks and reds. Photos should give you an idea of what I am talking about. I have yet to see my 6 foot OG Mikawa push anything but green, even though it is my favorite tree! These are all summer pictures for reference.. Sun exposure is everything when it comes to the colors they display. Colors are retained the entire growing season, these photos are of my trees and are not a one off situation, they do this every year. IMG_5233.jpeg IMG_5234.jpeg IMG_5079.jpeg
Hi Todd, I really appreciate the perspective. I bet the difference in our experiences (as I alluded to) is due to climate. My brother lives on Vashon Island and I visit him as often as possible. And when I'm in your lovely part of the country, I am always admiring the Japanese maples growing there, and the difference is quite obvious. A perfect example is Shirasawanum aureum. We can't even grow it here, much less keep it looking good. Also, the red reticulated and red/pink variegated forms. I don't even bother with them here because (in my opinion again) they don't even look good at all past May or June. But many people here go nuts for Purple Ghost and Shirazz (for examples), so go figure. By June, they just look like scraggly sickly Bloodgoods to me. To each his own. Fortunately, there are indeed good things about my climate here in the Piedmont of NC compared to my brother, and indeed there are many cultivars that do extremely well here. And mosses and lichens don't cover my mature specimens! Cheers KN
So good to have different opinions on cultivars. As yet to have one of these in my own collection to evaluate. Great photos Todd and it is these images that draw me to these particular trees.
Here is an example of a group of Japanese Princess taken on May 1, 2022. These were in Chapel Hill, NC, and shipped the previous year from a nursery in Oregon. As you can see, nothing special about them at all. Can't find my Mystic Mikawa photos from 10 or so years ago, but similar story.
Just from photo observation you have a lot of trees big trees in the background of the photo. I can see all the trunks and I see not a spec of sun. If you want color they need sun, not shade. The only shade they should get is from the hot afternoon sun from 2:00 on or so. And in spring they should be in full sun. I see people do this all the time, they shade the trees too much and then say there is nothing special about them. Same with Ukigumo people give it too much sun and wonder why they are not white, they need the shade to hold the whites. It’s all about lighting, these guys need the sun to bring the color! And our summers are brutal, 100 plus degrees and winds up to 25 mph, if you can hold color in those conditions you can do it in any conditions, for the most part.
I'm wondering if Oregon and Carolina zones are effecting the difference both @Todd Hastie and @kines are seeing. I hope both of you can follow up with photos of your Mikawa Yatsubusa varieties this year ? It is fascinating that there is such a difference being seen.
There are some differences of course, but Chappel Hill NC is zone 8a, and I am in 8b. So there not a huge difference in growing conditions. Other than sun and lighting. I know a guy there with a JP princes and he got it from Oregon, said the same thing no color. I told him to move the tree, and guess what happened.. But yes I will post monthly photos to show you that it will hold the colors.. Of course the whole tree is not pink, but it will hold pinks up top.
Totally agree that sun exposure (both duration and time of day) makes a huge difference. I have many maples in containers that I move around for this reason, to find the spot they are happiest with and look best. Here's a photo of a group of Japanese Princess from April 21, 2023. As you can see, they're getting plenty of sun. And looking quite unremarkably green.
I posted a picture of summer growth in my first response to you, but here it is again. Leaves become bleached on the tips with pinks and reds mixed in.. This photo was taken on July 16th, you can see some crispy edges on some leaves from the heat. IMG_5233.jpeg
My OG is chartreuse through and through. But I love this old girl. Here is a photo of my OG Mikawa and another of the varient Mikawa Kaen, both summer photos. Kaen has bronzes and reds during the summer. IMG_5050.jpeg IMG_5545.jpeg
The spring alone is worth having them I get a couple months of colors like this. IMG_6189.jpeg IMG_6186.jpeg
Regarding our similar USDA zones, as we all know, that metric alone has limited meaning and usefulness. I have spent a great amount of time around both Seattle and Chapel Hill, and I can tell you with certainty that the two climates are VERY different in more ways than they are similar. And the Japanese maples, the ferns, and the hostas all very much notice it. KN
I've read this thread with interest! Thanks. Have to ask, with apologies for seeming thick, what is OG? Reason for posting is simply to note that sun exposure in Corvalis, near where I recently had an excellent burger (with animal fries) at the In and Out, is not the same as in NC. This is something we often forget, that what may do well in full sun in OR, may burn to a crisp in full sun in NC. It's the amount of moisture in the air, cloud cover, how far north, etc. In Normandie where I live, although we don't have all of the Mikawa seedling flavors, full sun is (traditionally, less so these days) much less burning than, say, in the center or France; simply because the air has more moisture from the ocean, and the prevailing wind is W or SW, that is, direct from the Atlantic. Also, if we are growing in pots, cultural conditions have a huge effect on leaf color. The same is true in ground: here it is very acidic, usually pH under 5, so maples like AS 'Autumn Moon' stay very red/orange all season, even in shade. In more neutral conditions, they become much greener in shade. So, this is one of the reasons why it is complicated to evaluate cultivars in a limited set of circumstances, to truly evaluate how different they are needs a long time and a lot of environmental variation. -E
OG no matter what context it is used in stands for Original. As in the original Mikawa Yatsabusa with no variation. I definantly agree that pH effects colors, without question. So if they are in a pot it’s your choice in planting medium. And Oregon has brutal summers, don’t discount them. I fight every year to keep my trees from crisping. 100 plus degrees and 20-30 mph hot winds is not some easy climate to grow in. Our humidity is high as well because of the coastal winds that come in from the ocean. I am only about 30 miles inland from the water.
