fascinating read - thank you I bought several of those listed back in the day i did well with Thunderbird (huckleberry) my Blue Ravine (clematis) died it's interesting to realize how the history of recent gardening hobby (and wholesale industry) has changed over past 30 yrs - to think back that the average south Granville / west van garden had those orange florescent azaleas everywhere! (and mugo pines and junipers and that horrible (in my not-humble opinion) yellow buttercup groundcover - and did people intentionally plant ivy!? (and that old hanging basket vine that invades every park forest trail at the coast)