Identification: Snofozam - delicate single white weeping, mid-season

Discussion in 'Ornamental Cherries' started by Joseph Lin, Mar 16, 2010.

  1. Joseph Lin

    Joseph Lin Active Member 10 Years

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    I found another "single white Weeping cherry" at 3859 West 38 Ave. at Wallace St. NE corner. The flower is 3 cm wide with 1.3 x 0.9 narrower petals. The 2 cm pubescent pedicel holds 3~4 flowers.
     

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    Last edited: Mar 16, 2010
  2. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

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    Re: Single white Weeping cherry?

    'Snofozam'.
     
  3. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

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    Sold in the US using the registered trademark Snow Fountains. Common in Seattle.
     
  4. Joseph Lin

    Joseph Lin Active Member 10 Years

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    How to differentiate 'Snow Fountain' with 'Shidare-yoshino' ?
     
  5. wcutler

    wcutler Esteemed Contributor Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

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    In your photos here, the petals are narrow, as you mentioned, so they don't overlap, and to me they look more delicate, more like 'Beni-shidare' but white. [edited by wcutler 2011jan15: In your posting in the thread now named Sendai-shidare - Single white blossoms, mid-season, pendulous], your photos show the petals overlapping, so from the top, the blossoms look more like 'Somei-yoshino'. They look tougher to me, but I know one doesn't read botanical descriptions that say things like that.

    The examples of 'Shidare-yoshino' that I've seen are often broader trees, and the characteristic that made me guess that as the name of our 'Shidare-yoshino' trees was the thick twisted limbs.

    I don't see any leaves on your 'Snofozam' photo; the leaves come out with the blossoms on those other trees.
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2011
  6. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

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    Note that the cultivar name 'Snofozam' is enclosed in single quotes but the registered trademark Snow Fountains is not. Only cultivar names are indicated by the use of single quotes.

    Registered trademarks are marketing devices used to sell cultivars. For purposes of illustration, here are some comparisons (perhaps not of strict parallels, but probably close enough to make the point):

    'Snofozam': gelatin

    Snow Fountains: Jello

    'Snofozam': glyphosate

    Snow Fountains: RoundUp

    Before trademarks and registered trademarks (and plant patents) were used in the marketing of plants only botanical, cultivar, and common names were involved. Now selling names (trademarks etc.) are common and need to be understood in order to refer to them accurately when discussing plants.

    'Snofozam': 'Shidare-yoshino'

    Snow Fountains: [no equivalent, 'Shidare-yoshino' being a multiclonal cultivar with ostensibly no trademarks etc. being used to sell any of the clones]
     
  7. wcutler

    wcutler Esteemed Contributor Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

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    Re: Which single white weeping cherry, early mid season?

    I found a nursery's blog posting with photos of a tree said to be 30-35 years old (in 2011). That should be close to original for this cultivar, so that could give some indication what size to expect for an old tree.
     
  8. wcutler

    wcutler Esteemed Contributor Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

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    Re: Sendai-shidare - Single white blossoms, mid-season, pendulous

    I've copied this posting here from the Sendai-shidare thread, as it in part answers Joseph's posting. But I mis-read his question to be asking about 'Sendai-shidare', where he asked about 'Shidare-yoshino'. We've never talked about 'Shidare-yoshino', and though I saw a cutting last night, I don't really have any feel for what that is at all. Joseph, which tree were you asking about distinguishing from 'Snofozam'?

    Unlike the earlier pendulous trees with white blossoms, this 'Sendai-shidare' is putting out leaves before the blossoms are open at all.

    Note the long, thin sepals.
     

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  9. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

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    'Snofozam' is in full bloom all over down here at the moment.
     
  10. wcutler

    wcutler Esteemed Contributor Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

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    I need to get some 'Snofozam' leaves posted, so here are two trees we have been calling 'Snofozam'. These two photos of the tree near the Aquabus dock at the foot of Hornby were taken in March by Sue Wagner. There were no leaves when the tree was in bloom.
    20150310_Foot of Hornby_Snofozam_Wagner_ 2048x1536.jpg 20150310_Foot of Hornby_Snofozam_Wagner_ 2432x4320.jpg

    Here are leaf photos I took today, same tree.
    20150420_HornbySeawall_Snofozam_Cutler_142930.jpg 20150420_HornbySeawall_Snofozam_Cutler_143018.jpg 20150420_HornbySeawall_Snofozam_Cutler_143029.jpg 20150420_HornbySeawall_Snofozam_Cutler_143137.jpg

    This tree at Clive and McHardy has never been caught with flowers, but it seems to be the same as the Hornby Street one. The owner called it Snow Blossoms.
    20150420_CliveMcHardy_Snofozam_Cutler_184553.jpg 20150420_CliveMcHardy_Snofozam_Cutler_184614.jpg
     
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2021
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  11. Janice Lin

    Janice Lin Member

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    [Edited by wcutler: I have copied posts about this tree from the Burnaby Neighbourhood Blog. ]

    Sunny Chen took this photos on 04/07. Located on 6568 Sumas drive . Just wonder is this snofozan or Ito-zakura(white weeping cherry)?

    ito-zakura_6568Sumas _SunnyChen_8047.jpg ito-zakura_6568Sumas _SunnyChen_8048.jpg ito-zakura_6568Sumas _SunnyChen_8041.jpg ito-zakura_6568Sumas _SunnyChen_8050.jpg ito-zakura_6568Sumas _SunnyChen_8052.jpg ito-zakura_6568Sumas _SunnyChen_8948.jpg
     
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  12. Janice Lin

    Janice Lin Member

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    Snofozam at 4692 Victory . Photos taken by Sunny Chen. After dropping off her grandaughter at the preschool , she always wandered around the community. She is a very good cherry scout.
    Snowfozam_4692Victoria_Sunny_4692_IMG_8394.jpg Snowfozam_4692Victoria_Sunny_4692_IMG_8397.jpg Snowfozam_4692Victoria_Sunny_4692_IMG_8396.jpg
     
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  13. wcutler

    wcutler Esteemed Contributor Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

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    I don't know. Is there a younger more obvious 'Snofozam' to compare it to? I would like to see more photos of calyx tubes and sepals, and of open leaves' margins.
    The photos of ito-zakura I've checked have more calyces that are more shapely, with a tighter constriction between the bulge and the sepals. It's just so hard to believe that those young 'Snofozam' grow up to look like this. Maybe we could compare leaves on both those trees too.
     
  14. Janice Lin

    Janice Lin Member

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    Here are some more photos, taken by Emily Tsai and Tony Chen, not taken at the same day. Hope they can help to identify what this cherry is. Leaves emerge green during flowering.

    ??_6568 Sumas drive_TonyChen_20210409_851896_n.jpg ??_6568 Sumas drive_TonyChen_20210409_121830_n.jpg ??_6568 Sumas drive_Emily_20210405_101120.jpg ??_6568 Sumas drive_Emily_20210405_093418.jpg ??_6568 Sumas drive_Emily_20210410_153038.jpg ??_6568 Sumas drive_Emily_20210410_145451.jpg ito-zakura_6568Sumas _SunnyChen_20210407_8047.jpg ito-zakura_6568Sumas _SunnyChen_20210407_8948.jpg ito-zakura_6568Sumas _SunnyChen_20210407_8052.jpg ito-zakura_6568Sumas _SunnyChen_20210407_8050.jpg
     
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  15. wcutler

    wcutler Esteemed Contributor Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

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    Thanks, Janice, and thanks to Emily and Tony for such good photos.
    It looks like I'm going to have to make a pronouncement here. It won't be the first time I've named something wrong, so sure, I'll do this. I think that it's 'Snofozam', [edited: I thought I was agreeing with Janice, but she says not] and I just have to change my idea of what these can look like. They've been around since 1985, and I guess 36 years is enough time for a Prunus avium rootstock to get this hefty. I am deciding this mostly on the calyces, of which hardly any have the round urceolate shape (like an urn, with a bulge and then a rather tight constriction) that many of the calyces on ito-zakura have. Also, the branches are stiff and straight. It seems that both ito-zakura and 'Snofozam' can have serrations on the sepals.

    Here's another thing: Kuitert, Wybe, in Japanese Flowering Cherries (Timber Press, Portland, OR, 1999, p. 169) says for ito-zakura
    We don't have mature leaves, but these leaf tips seem more pronounced than small. But we do have glands, we don't have hairs on the leaf undersides, and the stipules are more like 20 to 2.5mm. So that's three strikes against ito-zakura.
    Too bad 'Snofozam' isn't included in this book. For now, that's what it is.
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2021
  16. Anne Eng

    Anne Eng Contributor 10 Years

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    Here is a comparison between Snofozam and Ito-zakura.

    1. Snofozam from VanDusen Botanical Garden (Shaughnessy) at April 6, 2021.
    20210406_VanDusen_Snofozam_Eng4475.jpeg 20210406_VanDusen_Snofozam_Eng_4478.jpeg

    2. Ito-zakura on SE corner of E. 30 and Fraser (Kensington) at April 11, 2021.
    20210411_E30Fraser_Ito-zakura_Eng_4580.jpeg 20210411_E30Fraser_Ito-zakura_Eng_4578.jpeg 20210411_E30Fraser_Ito-zakura_Eng_4571.jpeg
    Differences noted:
    a) Calyxes—The second photo for each shows the difference in calyxes, with Ito-zakura having a definite and prominent bulge.
    b) Flower Shape—Even as Ito-zakura is past peak bloom and showing red eye, the flowers have not opened much beyond their droopy, bell-like pendulas. Snofozam flowers are opening flat, and face-up so you can see the narrowing at the base of the petals.

    In Post #14, top row of photos, the third one shows both flower and calyx similar to the photo of VanDusen's Snofozam.

    To me, the tree at 6568 Sumas drive. appears to be a well-aged Snofozam, and not Ito-zakura.
     
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2021
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  17. Janice Lin

    Janice Lin Member

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    Snofozam on Selkirk & 33th street, private land.
    snofozam _33th&selkirk_janice_20210412_122517.jpg snofozam _33th&selkirk_janice_20210412_122605.jpg snofozam _33th&selkirk_janice_20210412_122613.jpg snofozam _33th&selkirk_janice_20210412_122640.jpg
     
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  18. Janice Lin

    Janice Lin Member

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    Ito zakura on 1123 33rd Avenue.
    ito zakura_1123-33th_janice_20210412_121602.jpg ito zakura_1123-33th_janice_20210412_121505.jpg ito zakura_1123-33th_janice_20210412_121620.jpg ito zakura_1123-33th_janice_20210412_121843.jpg
     
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