Identification: Identification of my 15 year old red dissectum

Hi,
I am new here in this forum and I have also no experience with forums yet. But I discovered this forum some days ago and joining it feels like going to `Maple Addicts Anonymous`.

I am from Austria near Vienna and though I planted some Japanese maples 15 years ago I had no expertise in this field and due to the birth of 3 kids in 3 following years also no time. Now I have started to devote more time to our garden and engaged myself in the world of Japanese maples. I recently bought Mikawa Yatsubusa, Seiyru, Orange Dream, Garnet and Spring D elight.

My `old` ones are Red Emperor, Enkan, Acer griseum and one red Dissectum that I would like to ask you to identify.
I bought it for 2 Euros and 10 cm high (and almost dead because they forgot to water it) in a gardencenter. I only put it in a tiny hole in the ground without any preparation (no acid soil, only our extreme hardcore mixture of gravel and heavy loam!) and watered it for the first 2 days). Since then I only let it grow without pruning and even looking at it . Nevertheless it proved extremely resilient and with time it grew to one of my favourite plants in our garden.
As I was of the impreesion that there is only one kind of red Dissectum until recently I thought they are all called Garnet. This year I wanted to add another one of the same kind, because I love its bright colour even in summer (full sun) I bought a Dissectum Garnet. It was darker than my old one, but I thought it is just because it was standing more shady in the nursery. But now it is standing in the full sun for 6 weeks and is much darker than my old one. I am positive that the new one is a true Garnet as the nursery is specialised on Japanese Maples. But which one could my old one be? Can you guess from the pictures? Maybe a Crimson Queen?

I have the feeling that it hasn`t been so bright coloured from the beginning, I think that when he was small he was a darker shade, but as I said our garden was not one of my priorities when the kids were small so I didn`t pay attention to it...

The 2 pictures atop and the left one in the second line are from the sunnier side, the middle and right one in the bottom line are from the shadier side, but it has sun all day long.

 

@sun, good morning and welcome to the maples forum. That is a beautiful maple and a bargain. IMO it is either Acer palmatum 'Red or Pink filigree lace'.
As you have said, you didn't do anything to it and this is the beauty of the dissected varieties, they can be left with little or no work other than a watering in the Summer.
Your collection is wonderful, you must post photos.

 

Welcome to the AA forum (Acers Anonymous) lol. We all suffer the addiction analysis gladly welcome you into the fold. Before I even saw @Acerholic reply I thought to myself.. “that looks like my Pink Filigree”. I have Red Filigree too but the leaves are more finely dissected so I don’t think it is that. Mine is also a darker red than your very beautiful specimen. It is very difficult and almost impossible to identify with 100% confidence as there are so many red dissected varieties, and each one can look quite similar/different depending on location and conditions etc.

Regarding your other trees.. Stunning. I think @Acerholic has covered! Lol.

 

Would look at moving the Spring delight to a more shadier position though , find this cultivar to be very fussy when it comes to placement in the garden , yes it will grow nicely where you have it now but as the name suggest's the beauty of this cultivar is in the spring when it shows off it's lovely red edgings on the light green leaf through the spring flush which only last's a few weeks then turns to a solid deep green for the summer finishing with a stunning golden orange /yellow. Find also they prefer to be kept in containers if you want to see really good colours otherwise if left in the ground you might just think it looks like Viridis. Some pics of mine over the past few years all in pots.

 

@ROEBUK, good evening M your first photo of Spring delight would make anybody want to go straight out and buy this one. Who cares if it's like Viridis all Summer, that's not so bad either IMO.

 

I would just call it... Acer palmatum 'Atropurpureum Dissectum'.

Very nice tree by the way.

 

@ROEBUK , funny that you said I should move it as I just told my husband that it maybe has to move as I am researching so many different cultivars since I have found this forum that I consider a lot of new ones as soon as possible and switch some places. I will certainly consider putting it in a pot.
Yours really looks amazing!
If you have suggestions for small cultivars that might look good at the foot of this sunny hill I would love to hear all your ideas. I will post a picture tomorrow which shows the main view from the terrace to the hill so that you get an idea...
@AlainK thank you, I have never heard of Atropurpureum Dissectum. I will google it tomorrow, have to get up early tomorrow and need some sleep now...

 

Ups, I didn`t want to attach the last 6 pictures...

 

@sun, good afternoon A, I think this would be better in a new thread entitled something like 'Ideas for new maples in my garden', or something similar.
If you start a new thread, I will move this posting to it for you.

 

@Acerholic Today I spent one hour under my Dissectum, I didn`t know I would fit under it. I have read a lot about tidying, thinning out and cutting open Dissectums today . I removed all dead wood and cut some smaller branches, growing in the wrong directions. There are two placeswher big branches are spiralling each other or growing together that cannot be removed without damaging both.
I thought about laying a bit of the lower branch structure open in the future, but as is is not very tall I am not sure if it would look as good as on the taller ones where you would still have a big canopy on top of the stem and main branches.
Other than that I would like to shorten the tips of the branches that are lying on the ground, especially on the pool deck as it doesn`t look so good.
And I would like to remove the branch that stands right out of the globular shape, but it is quite a thick branch, so I don`t know if the tree would suffer.

This is a picture of the Branch that I would like to remove, it divides in a bigger upper branch and a lower branch


Here you see where it comes from. The out sticking branch is the one that grows to the brightes spot in the picture in direction of the pool


This is the whole trunk

and the outsticking branch from the outside

 

Very nice.

If you think it is unbalanced, perhaps you could prune it where I put a yellow cross, just before a shoot that could be like the green arrow. It's hard to say from photos, but I think that if you prune it lower, it might leave a hole :

 

I agree with Alain. @sun removing that whole branch would leave a distasteful look.

I love looking under my dissectums. I love them even more doing the winter.

 

... You could even do something like that right now :

 

@sun, good evening A. OK how much have you removed already? 20% is enough at this time of year. Working from underneath is definatly the correct way to prune and shape a maple.
If you have removed only dead branches and a few others then you will be able to remove the branch you want to now. It is suffering from pool water chemical splash anyway.
I would take it right right back to the fork where it separates to branching on the right. A good pruning saw under and over to stop splitting is necessary. This is going to leave a large gap for the next couple of years, but you will see it start to fill in next Summer.
Anymore pruning I would then leave until it is dormant and has no leaves at all, you can then see the main structure of this tree. That is when you can see where you want to train it and in the shape you want. Always look for buds to prune to.
Also too much thinning and pruning now only lessens the beauty of the amount of Autumn colours.
Hope that's of some help.

 

@Acerholic @LoverOfMaples @AlainK
Thank you all for replying, I am out atm with almost no mobile data legt, I write back tomorrow...

 

There's no hurry, that's your tree, take the time to think it over...

 

@Acerholic @LoverOfMaples @AlainK
I read everything carefully and "examined" the protruding branch again today to get a better idea today how big the hole would be if it was removed.

D, I just wanted to make sure I understood you correctly. You suggested to remove the whole protruding branch, the thicker upper part and the lower thinner part, right? Like I marked on this foto:


I also talked to my husband. He would be relieved if the branch is removed as it constantly interferes with the cover of our pool, which will only get worse during the years.

@AlainK I also considered both your suggestions and looked up all the crosses and arrows on the actual plant outside. As it is better seen in reality than on my pictures, anything other than removing the whole branch might give the tree the chance to sprout another protruding branch in the pool direction. And the tips of the branch really often get crushed by the roll of the pool cover. That`s why I decided to take my chance and remove it right where it has its source. Knowing me I can live better with a hole that is getting smaller with time than a branch I don`t like (and would constantly look at) which will even grow bigger during the years.
I will post pictures afterwards and you are of course welcome to say "I told you so" :))

@Acerholic I really did only remove a lot of thin dead wood (I haven`t done any pruning or tidying on the Dissectum ever before) and cut only 3 thin branches of 1 cm or under. Concerning the saw, this is the one I bought some days ago.



I must admit that I haven`t done any regular pruning at all in our garden till now and if I had to remove a branch which was too thick for the garden scissors I took my husband`s electric saw (which of course isn`t for gardening) I take it that this time you also don`t want me to use it.(?)

Could you maybe show me what yours looks like and what is important for it to be a good saw?

I do not understand this sentence. Do you mean I should saw from above and from underneath?

Can I also shorten the tips of the remaining branches, so that there is about 10 cm air betwenn them and the ground?

 

@LoverOfMaples BTW your Dissectum seems to be a bit more spacious from the inside than mine. Nevertheless I could sit upright after I had removed all the dead wood and both chickens have followed me in and sat right beside me. My husband only found us because he heard me talking to the chickens:)

 

@sun, good morning A, IMO yes that is where I would cut it out along the line as you have marked.
Regarding the saw to use, that one is perfect, identical to mine other than handle colour.
Regarding the cut, if you start on top and then look underneath and start a cut, this will stop tearing when you are over half way cutting from the top. This ensures a clean cut to the branch. Make sure the two cuts will meet though.
The wound will heal, so dont worry about buying a paste to seal it. The white from the cut maybe visable for a season, but it soon fades nicely.
Do post photos after you have completed the surgery. I would say good luck, but you really dont need it.

 

@Acerholic ,okay D, btw I have a paste at home:


Did you just want to spare me the trouble of buying one or do you think it`s like human wounds that heal better with air on it?

Can I shorten the tips of the remaining branches so that they are about 10 cm above the ground as well?

 

@sun, it is up to you if you want to use the paste, some people on the forums do some don't. I let them heal naturally and have not had a problem with this. Paste can seal in problems IMO. @AlainK , Alain might disagree and I fully respect that.
Regards to trimming ends, remember any stop cuts like this will result in two shoots from that cut next season. So pruning next February to the buds you want it to grow from in Spring 2021 is important.
But of course you can tidy aesthetically now.
Hope that's of help A.

 

@Acerholic, yes D , thanks that helps and I will educate on pruning till February

I have done it. I think I managed quite a clean cut and the hole isn`t as big as expected!



My chickens also like it, it`s their new favourite spot now...

 

I post another before picture...

 

@sun, well done A, that looks really good, not sure what the chickens think about it though, lol. Notice how the leaves that don't get the sun are green !!
You will be more confident about pruning now.
Well done again.

 

@Acerholic Thanks :))