Hi, Was wondering if anyone has any experience growing Pinus lumholtzii in BC, Washington or Oregon. I live in Vancouver BC and have a couple of P. patula which are nice weeping mexican pines. P. lumholtzii sounds like another nice weeping pine. Thanks for any stories.
Don't think I've seen that one here, but a small number of Pinus patula are being grown in Seattle and vicinity. 1990 winter (or a somewhat earlier one) basically wiped out the older set, current ones that I know of all comparatively small. Probably most often seen pre-1990 planting was several on west-facing wall of visitor center at government locks. These grew up from behind wall, well up into wind, then froze.
As far as I know, it has never been tried properly. The species is unusual in that the altitudes it grows at are higher toward the northern end of the range, up to 2500m in southernmost Chihuahua, but around 1500-2000m in Jalisco. So the northernmost high altitude origins should (at least in theory!) be hardier than P. patula (they should be as hardy as e.g. Picea chihuahuana, which occurs at similar altitudes in the area). A trip to Mexico to collect your own seed would be the best bet, try around Guadalupe y Calvo to El Vergel in southern Chihuahua. The cones are probably ripe in the period January-March, though this hasn't been researched; some October-collected cones I was given from the El Vergel area were nearly but not fully ripe (and a November-collected cone from Jalisco was even less ripe). There also seems to be a problem with low seed production (most of the cones I was given were empty, only with blind and hollow seeds; the few filled seeds didn't germinate), so collect plenty. One other potential problem with growing the species is that it is adapted to summer rain and winter drought, so the PNW winter rainfall may well be unsuitable for it, causing root decay and also snowbreak in the event of heavy snow
Excellent post Michael, where did you learn Conifers? I expect it from Ron to know his plants but you know your Conifers pretty well. The only thing I will add to the above posts is that this Pine will act much like a Pinus patula did, as Ron pointed out, with a long period of intense cold like we had in 1990 and again somewhat in 1991. We lost a few of them at our nursery because of the cold. The other thing is that this Pine may not be happy with the heavy clay soils in parts of Oregon. I just don't see people up there field growing this Pine much. This Pine will want relatively fast drainage from what little I've seen of it. We were not overly impressed with it for our area but for many areas of Southern California it should grow okay for people. Jim
Thanks Ron, Is that lock the one in Ballard? Thanks Michael, I actually might go to Mexico. I think they can also be found in Sonora. I really appreciate your detail. Thanks Jim, I was wondering, do you still grow P. lumholtzii at your nursery?
Yes: Ballard. Plant collection is now called Carl English Botanical Garden. Some friends went to Mexico this year, to look at conifers. http://www.botanik.uni-bonn.de/conifers/topics/mexico_trip.htm
We had 9 fairly young plants that came in to us that originally came to our source into the US as seed from an arboretum. As I remember it, the seed did come from Sonora, not from Chihuahua. We did get some seed later that a worker brought back with him but we felt that Pine was the Pinus chiapensis - Chiapas White Pine instead. We did not propagate these Pines as for us they were monitoring plant material, watch them and see what they do. I believe 3 of the original plants are still at the nursery planted in the ground but the new owner will not know what they are but Humberto is still there and will know where the Chiapas White Pines are. I am no longer involved with the remnants of what is left of the old, original nursery and have not been for almost 9 years. It seems to me that you will have to go the route that many others have had to do and that is either get some cones from or get seed out of Mexico. There may be some sources in Southern California and possibly Arizona growing the Lumholtz's Pine but I just do not see it being grown even remotely on a grand scale as of yet and may not ever have a huge following as only a few select gardens and Pine collectors will ask for this Pine by name. Jim
Likewise, probably not ever listed in North American wholesale catalogs (<1996, anyway) as I don't see it in Jacobson, North American Landscape Trees.
I should have been more clear. Humberto is from Chiapas, Mexico and brought back seed for us to germinate and grow. He was under the impression that it may be what we already had at the nursery, Lumholtz's Pine but his was the Chiapas White Pine instead as we later learned. Likewise, probably not ever listed in North American wholesale catalogs. I agree with the above. Even today this Pine is not very well known at all. Jim
Thanks everyone for the info. Thanks Ron for the great pine hunting trip in Mexico link. Ron, have you looked at pines in Mexico?
