Acer palmatum x A. pseudosieboldianum 'North Wind'

Discussion in 'Maple Photo Gallery' started by maplesmagpie, Nov 12, 2014.

  1. maplesmagpie

    maplesmagpie Active Member

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    Acer x pseudosieboldianum 'North Wind'

    Broad green upright.

    From Iseli Nursery: "North Wind® is the flagship member of the Jack Frost® Series, bred by Iseli Nursery to tolerate harsh and dramatic weather shifts that occur in many regions of the country. It has been unscathed at Iowa testing locations including winter temperatures of -30°F. The palmate leaves emerge red in spring changing by midsummer to green, followed by a dramatic orange-scarlet in fall. "

    I saw this tree at a nursery in the spring, and you could see it from across two lots. Bright coral, shrimpy red. It was gorgeous. While I was looking at the six or so specimens they had, one was carted away for the big arboretum in Madison, WI. Two others were tagged and sold. The nursery said they were flying out. I couldn't afford the larger trees at that particular nursery, so the folks at Iseli looked at who else was shipping them in to our state, and gave me the name of a few nurseries selling smaller sizes. A long drive later and there's a North Wind in our yard.

    Our tree is planted in solid shade and stayed green throughout the summer, then turned yellow with green veining, then flushed bright gold with tips of red and orange. Very pretty. My friend who had it in a sunnier location reported a second sprout, mid-summer, of the coral-red leaves.

    I added an updated photo of the tree/form after three-plus years. The cultivar puts on an incredible show each fall-- starting with yellows and peaches, then getting very bright orange and red, with hints of yellow. I like this tree a lot.
     

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    Last edited: Nov 6, 2016
  2. maplesandpaws

    maplesandpaws Active Member

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    Re: Acer x pseudosieboldianum 'North Wind'

    Sounds and looks lovely! Do you have a picture of the whole tree? What size did you end up buying? May have to look into this one, would be nice to not have to worry about the cold-tolerance of a maple here...
     
  3. maplesmagpie

    maplesmagpie Active Member

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    Re: Acer x pseudosieboldianum 'North Wind'

    I bought a well-branched tree about 5.5 feet high. It was only $60 at a local nursery.

    I don't have a photo of the whole tree, but you can see a few if you google Iseli North Wind.

    And yes-- it says it's hardy down to zone 4. My sister is trying one, the sister tree (Arctic Jade), in Minneapolis.
     
  4. maplesmagpie

    maplesmagpie Active Member

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    Re: Acer x pseudosieboldianum 'North Wind'

    Just leafing out this spring... very vigorous, not a bit of die back on the tips.

    My sister has the sister tree to this variety, the Arctic Jade, and it did very well as a new transplant in northern Minnesota. It's leafing out with bright green leaves, not this pink/medium green of the North Wind.
     

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  5. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

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    Re: Acer x pseudosieboldianum 'North Wind'

    Why do you have a cross mark in front of the species name, does somebody now think this is a hybrid species?
     
  6. maf

    maf Well-Known Member Maple Society

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    Re: Acer x pseudosieboldianum 'North Wind'

    That is the designation that Iseli nursery (the introducers) are using. Presumably the cultivar is a hybrid of Korean and Japanese maples but whether it is pseudosieboldianum x palmatum or the reverse I do not know.
     
  7. maplesmagpie

    maplesmagpie Active Member

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    Re: Acer x pseudosieboldianum 'North Wind'

    Yes, I was told it's a hybrid between a Korean maple and Acer palmatum.

    Here's another photo from today. I think the pink color would normally be brighter, but this tree is in pretty deep shade.
     

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  8. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

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    Re: Acer x pseudosieboldianum 'North Wind'

    Then the epithet would not be Acer x pseudosieboldianum because that presentation indicates A. pseudosieboldianum itself is a hybrid - that is what I was asking about. If no separate name for the cross exists then the cultivar should be listed as A. 'North Wind'.
     
  9. maplesmagpie

    maplesmagpie Active Member

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    Re: Acer x pseudosieboldianum 'North Wind'

    I'm going by how the nursery lists it. In this forum there seem to be several Acer x ______.

    Perhaps we should leave it up to the forum moderators?
     
  10. maf

    maf Well-Known Member Maple Society

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    Re: Acer x pseudosieboldianum 'North Wind'

    Ron is correct that the name Acer x pseudosieboldianum would indicate A. pseudosieboldianum is a hybrid species, which is obviously not the intention of the introducers of this maple. Unfortunately this seems to be the only name this tree has been promoted under.

    I find simply using Acer 'cultivar name' to not be very helpful and would prefer this to be written with both parental names ie. Acer palmatum x A. pseudosieboldianum 'North Wind'. I know that Acer palmatum x A. pseudosieboldianum is a legitimate name for a hybrid between these two species, but can this also be used with a cultivar name or does it absolutely have to be Acer 'North Wind'?

    I am not a biologist so would appreciate some advice on this before I change anything regarding the thread title.

    I also would appreciate if anyone has the maples checklist of names to see if it is listed there and what form they use. (It might be too new to be included.)

    (As an aside, if I am going to be botanically 100% correct on everything a number of longstanding A. palmatum cultivars would have to be removed from the palmatum photo gallery. That would just be too confusing!)
     
  11. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

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    Re: Acer x pseudosieboldianum 'North Wind'

    If no epithet exists for the cross then put the parents before the cultivar. As for your last comment it depends on how much you value accuracy. When I am using a reference that is supposed to be authoritative I want it to be giving me the full and true story whenever this is known.
     
  12. maf

    maf Well-Known Member Maple Society

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    Re: Acer x pseudosieboldianum 'North Wind'

    Okay, I am changing the thread title to Acer palmatum x A. pseudosieboldianum 'North Wind'. Because it is known in the trade as Acer x pseudosieboldianum 'North Wind' I will leave a permanent redirect from that name.

    If anyone has any views on this please comment...
     
  13. maf

    maf Well-Known Member Maple Society

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    BTW, I used Acer palmatum x A. pseudosieboldianum 'North Wind' because it is now the preferred nomenclature to arrange the order of the parents alphabetically. I am used to the traditional plant breeding way of listing the female parent first, this was news to me.
     
  14. Eric La Fountaine

    Eric La Fountaine Contributor UBC Botanical Garden Forums Administrator Forums Moderator 10 Years

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    Re: Acer x pseudosieboldianum 'North Wind'

    Do we actually know that it is a cross between A. palmatum and A. pseudosieboldianum?

    http://www.iselinursery.com/index.php/japanese-maples/822-acer-x-pseudosieboldianum-north-wind

    It rather sounds like that is the case, but they don't really state where "the beauty of the Japanese maple" comes from.

    In any case the × before pseudosieboldianum is incorrect.

    Acer 'North Wind' is a good name. We may have Acer pseudosieboldianum 'North Wind', or it may be A. pseudosieboldianum × A. palmatum 'North Wind'.
     
  15. Eric La Fountaine

    Eric La Fountaine Contributor UBC Botanical Garden Forums Administrator Forums Moderator 10 Years

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    I was just looking through the International Code of Nomenclature for Cultivated Plants. They indicated that either method of listing the parents of hybrids was OK, but that if alphabetic one should add the gender symbols to them. I was reading the 1997 copy. There must be a more recent issue than that.
     
  16. maf

    maf Well-Known Member Maple Society

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    Re: Acer x pseudosieboldianum 'North Wind'

    Good point Eric, I had considered this but did not mention in my previous posts so as to not muddy the water. My criteria for assuming A. palmatum are firstly that this species is what is generally referred to as "Japanese maple" and secondly that the hybrid leaf shape looks to be influenced in the direction of A. palmatum rather than A. japonicum, A. sieboldianum or A. shirasawanum which would be the most likely other candidates.

    I will add an extra redirect from A. 'North Wind'.
     
  17. maf

    maf Well-Known Member Maple Society

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    From
    International Code of Nomenclature

    for
    algae, fungi, and plants
    (Melbourne Code)

    adopted by the Eighteenth International Botanical Congress Melbourne, Australia, July 2011​


    If I am reading that correctly the gender symbols are now optional and the alphabetical sequence is now the norm.
     
  18. maplesmagpie

    maplesmagpie Active Member

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    Has anyone called Iseli? I've called about other questions and they've been very responsive.
     
  19. maf

    maf Well-Known Member Maple Society

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    Acer 'North Wind'

    Acer 'North Wind'

    I'm not about to make an international call to Iseli to ask them about this but if they choose to post their opinion here in this public forum it would be much appreciated.
     
  20. maplesmagpie

    maplesmagpie Active Member

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    This is where I read about its parentage:

    "Acer
    ‘North Wind’: North Wind hybrid maple
    A new hybrid tree bred with the cold hardy
    Acer pseudosieboldianum
    (Korean maple)
    and the very ornamental
    Acer palmatum
    (Japanese maple) as its parents. North Wind
    has proven cold hardy to zone 4a (-30°F).
    The leaves are green, palmately lobed,
    emerg ing red in spring changing to green in
    summer. The fall color is a mixture of orange
    and red tones. The form is upright, growing
    to about 15-20' tall and 24' wide. It does best
    in moist, well-drained, loamy, fertile soil and
    is intolerant to excessive heat and drought.
    This selection is introduced by Iseli Nursery,
    Boring, Oregon"

    It's from the Spring 2012 publication of the Wisconsin Arborist Association (WAA).

    http://www.waa-isa.org/pdf/Spring2012/WAA Newsletter Spring 2012 Issue.pdf
     
  21. maf

    maf Well-Known Member Maple Society

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    Thanks maplesmagpie, that confirms the palmatum parentage.
     
  22. maplesmagpie

    maplesmagpie Active Member

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    I just called them and they're going to send a link of this discussion to Paul, the plant propagator who is responsible for North Wind (well done, Paul). Hopefully he'll chime in.
     
  23. Eric La Fountaine

    Eric La Fountaine Contributor UBC Botanical Garden Forums Administrator Forums Moderator 10 Years

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  24. maplesmagpie

    maplesmagpie Active Member

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    Summer color (in full shade):
     

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  25. maplesmagpie

    maplesmagpie Active Member

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    Fall color, even in full shade, was extraordinary and long-lasting. Even our cranky neighbors noticed it and complimented the colors. It changed colors over many days, from yellows and oranges to bright reds. It was the best color show of my 30 JMs in 2015, with Orangeola's long-lasting red display in second.
     

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