tree id

Discussion in 'Plants: Identification' started by jmx, Oct 15, 2022.

  1. jmx

    jmx New Member

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    Hi,
    Any idea what this tree may be ?
    It's around 10m tall, growing in a park in Ireland.
    Thanks in advance
     

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  2. Silver surfer

    Silver surfer Generous Contributor 10 Years

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    I am really struggling to see enough detail in pic 3.
    The leaves almost appear to be trifoliate. Which has a single stalk and 3 leaflets. eg Ptelea???
    Please can you go back and pick a leaf where it comes from the branch and take another pic.
    Can you look for other clues, such as flowers or seed pods, berries etc.
     

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  3. jmx

    jmx New Member

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    Thanks for your feedback.
    The leaves are not trifoliate. Moreover, I have not seen any flower or fruit on this tree.
    I will go back there, and take other pictures.
     
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  4. wcutler

    wcutler Paragon of Plants Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

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    See if you can also get a photo showing the shape of the tree.
     
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  5. jmx

    jmx New Member

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    I have taken a few additional photos,but I don't think they will be helpful.
    Could this be Cladrastis sinensis ?
     
  6. wcutler

    wcutler Paragon of Plants Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

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    Cladrastis leaves are compound. It looks like you're saying these are simple leaves when you said "The leaves are not trifoliate", and they do look simple to me in your third photo.
    It doesn't seem that people have enough to go on with what has been posted so far. If you go back again for better photos, please be sure to take one of the whole tree, and one of the underside of the leaves, in addition to what Silver surfer requested.
     
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  7. Michael F

    Michael F Paragon of Plants Forums Moderator 10 Years

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    Pic 3 in the first post, if you look carefully, the leaves are definitely trifoliate. The branch structure certainly looks something in the Fabaceae, but Cladrastis sinensis can be excluded as that has 9-13 leaflets (and the other Cladrastis species, nearly as many).
     
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  8. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

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    First picture is showing a single leaf also, with the enlarged petiole base at the top of the specimen indicating the point of attachment.
     
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  9. jmx

    jmx New Member

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    Hi,

    Here are the 2 additional pictures, taken yesterday at 1PM (you can see how dull the weather was).
    You won't see a lot more than in the other ones ; the leaves I am taking are more than 2 meters high, I can't take a better picture whithout breaking them.
    IMG_1271[1].JPG IMG_1270[1].JPG


    Here is the picture of a Cladrastis wilsonii :
    Cladrastis wilsonii - Trees and Shrubs Online
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 16, 2022
  10. wcutler

    wcutler Paragon of Plants Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

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    Just to be clear what we're talking about, taking the photo from your link, when you click on this, you can see two red ovals that each indicate a single leaf, each with 11 or more leaflets. The purple circle shows what the attachment looks like for the leaflets to the leaf rachis. The blue circle shows what the attachment looks like for a leaf to the branch, with a more swollen area at the petiole base where it attaches. That was the point of Ron B's comment in posting #8.
    cladrastis-wilsonii-12_jmx_wlc.jpg
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2022
  11. Silver surfer

    Silver surfer Generous Contributor 10 Years

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    Just to clarify large pic above is copied from www.

    Cladrastis wilsonii - Trees and Shrubs Online

    Cladastris wilsonii seems to be extremely rare.

    2 x New small pics of mystery tree do not help with id in any way.

    P.S Edit...large pic now been removed.
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2022
  12. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

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    Leaves certainly similar but bark shown here does not fit Cladrastis - are you sure that was the same tree as the leaves?
     
  13. Silver surfer

    Silver surfer Generous Contributor 10 Years

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    No sign of any autumn colours.
    Is it evergreen?
     
  14. jmx

    jmx New Member

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    Hopefully, I will be able to take better pictures of the leaves after they have fallen.

    I don't think this tree is evergreen ; if you look behind it, you will see an Ulmus glabra whose leaves are still present and green. I expect the leaves to fall in 1 month.

    Yes, the bark in my picture is not “thin and smooth”, I will double check, but I don't think my picture is from another tree.
     
  15. Silver surfer

    Silver surfer Generous Contributor 10 Years

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    Tree is big , it will not be noticed if you pick a small branch to take clear, sharp pics.
     
  16. jmx

    jmx New Member

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    I found a dead branch (probably broken by a storm), here are some pictures
     

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  17. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

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    Shriveled leaves don't offer much information
     
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  18. jmx

    jmx New Member

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    Its shows the arrangement of the leaves (or leaflets) on the stalk.
     

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