Sequoias and Douglas Firs in Croatia?

Discussion in 'Plant Propagation' started by lettuce, Oct 3, 2008.

  1. lettuce

    lettuce Active Member

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    Hi,

    I have plans to order 100 seeds of Sequoiadendron giganteum and 60 seeds of Pseudotsuga menziesii var. viridis.
    I live in Croatia, Europe and been wondering whether the climate here will be adequate for seed germination?
    I would store the seeds in refrigerator during winter. In spring I would sow them outside in a sunny location. What are the chances of germination? Any tips that would improve germ.rates?

    Thanx!
     
  2. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

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    M. Frankis should have an idea of suitability for climate there, maybe he will see your post soon. For germination requirements try surfing "sequoiadendron germination" (or "propagation") etc.
     
  3. lettuce

    lettuce Active Member

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    I'm not too sure about chances of germination and from what I've read on the internet, germ. rates for sequoia are very very low in their natural habitat. On the other hand, there is an approximately 100 year old sequoia tree here where I live, but it was brought here from US as a small seedling. Apparently, climate is adequate for growth so I'm looking for ways to improve germination because the seeds are all I can get, no seedlings. And if someone can tell the actual germination percentage. As I recall it was around 10% last time I googled for help....
     
  4. Michael F

    Michael F Paragon of Plants Forums Moderator 10 Years

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    Should be OK, at least in the short term. If you're at low altitude, you'll probably find Sequoiadendron won't last overly long in low altitude heat; saw quite a lot in northern Italy last month which were dying back badly after reaching 20-30m tall and 50-100 years old. At Croatia's latitude, it would do better at around ~500-1000m altitude.

    Germination rates may be even lower for cultivated origin seed, due to scarcity of specimens resulting in poor pollination.

    PS "Pseudotsuga menziesii var. viridis" = Pseudotsuga menziesii var. menziesii.
     
  5. lettuce

    lettuce Active Member

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    here's the photo of the sequoia tree that I mentioned. its about 100 years old (few years more or less).

    didn't know that (thanx), just did a copy-paste from http://hr.kpr.sk/ (site where I'll order from)

    if what you say is true, even if I manage to germinate some seeds, the future for them doesn't look too bright. Im not sure about altitude of location where I live, certainly not 500m.

    Maybe I shouldn't order Sequoiadendron giganteum, it may well be a waste of money. Any germination friendly suggestions? I'm looking for conifers...
     

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  6. Millet

    Millet Well-Known Member 10 Years

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    For the easiest and most successful method of propagation of Sequoiadendron giganteum seed plant the seed in the fall AS SOON as the seed is mature and comes out of the cone easily. Seed to be planted at other times should be dried thoroughly, and stratified for sixty days at 40 degrees F (4C). It is important that the seed beds should be KEPT SHADED. Not knowing the age of the seed and its previous care when purchased from a seed dealer, can often cause a big disparity in the germination rate. I have seen Sequoiadendron giganteum growing near Invernes, Scotland where the winters are cold, and the summers cool with periods of morning fog. The trees were nearing 100 years old and looked to be very healthy. You should inquire with the seller the age of the seed and how they have been cared for. Good luck. - Millet
     
  7. Michael F

    Michael F Paragon of Plants Forums Moderator 10 Years

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    No reason why not - it'll still likely outlast you, even if it won't make the 3,000 years it can do in the wild. The 100-year specimen in your pic is reasonably OK, though does show the same thin crown and small patches of dead foliage I was seeing on trees in N Italy. Some I saw there were a bit better, but most somewhat worse.
    Yep, the cool summers (and mild, not cold, winters) there are very good for it. They'll be much denser and healthier than Lettuce's pic.

    Here's some near me in northeastern England, an avenue (left), and an experimental plantation with trees 40-48m tall (right):
     

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  8. Millet

    Millet Well-Known Member 10 Years

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    Michael, very nice pictures, thank you for posting them. I believe the worlds largest Sequoiadendron giganteum are the trees growing in the Sequoia National forest in California USA. I've been there several times to see them - what a treat and enjoyment. - Millet
     
  9. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

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    The General Sherman tree: height 83.6 m, dbh 825 cm, crown spread 33 m, located in Sequoia National Park, CA. This tree also has the largest known stem volume, 1473.4 m3. The second largest stem volume is recorded for the General Grant tree in Kings Canyon National Park, CA, which is 885 cm dbh and 81.1 m tall. However, the largest dbh (898 cm) and the largest footprint (87.14 m2) are recorded for the Boole Tree in Kings Canyon National Park (Van Pelt 2001). It is perhaps worth noting that timber scaling data show at least one specimen of Sequoia sempervirens logged in the early 20th Century had a recorded stem volume of approximately 1540 m3 (Robert Van Pelt, e-mail, 29-Jul-1999). The tallest known giant sequoia is a specimen 94.9 m tall, first measured Aug-1998 by Michael Taylor in the Redwood Mountain Grove, California, but 94.9 m tall in July 2005 (Steve Sillett, pers. comm., 28-Jul-2005).

    http://www.conifers.org/cu/se2/index.htm
     
  10. lettuce

    lettuce Active Member

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    thank you very much for this!

    Yes, that's what I've been thinking:)
    That avenue photograph of yours is beautiful, I love it!
     
  11. lettuce

    lettuce Active Member

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    I found out that Sequoiadendron giganteum seeds are one year old (harvested last october) and they've been stored in a cooler at 1-3°C since. Being stored at 1-3°C would indicate the seeds haven't lost their viability. Should I go ahead and order the seeds even if they're a year old?
     
  12. Michael F

    Michael F Paragon of Plants Forums Moderator 10 Years

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    That will be fine. The trees often store the seeds in the closed cones for 20-30 years, so one year is nothing to worry about.
     
  13. lettuce

    lettuce Active Member

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    thank you Michael...

    umm, one more question. I'll probably receive the seeds in 2weeks time. I'm thinking to put the seeds in a refrigerator at 4°C, then sow them outside in early spring? Would that be fine?
     
  14. Michael F

    Michael F Paragon of Plants Forums Moderator 10 Years

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    That would be fine, yes.
     
  15. Millet

    Millet Well-Known Member 10 Years

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    Depending on how large a supply of seeds you ordered, and *if* they were my seeds, I would plant some out side now (in Colorado, a cold winter state) for Mother Nature to germinate in the spring, and I would stratify the rest of the seeds until spring in the refrigerator. Either way is correct, just my preference. - Millet
     
  16. Michael F

    Michael F Paragon of Plants Forums Moderator 10 Years

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    The only problem with planting outside now, is that various parts of mother nature (mice, birds, etc) will eat a lot of the seeds . . . mother nature gets round this by supplying millions of seeds, but seed companies don't do that (or at least do so only at huge cost!).
     

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