Reverted Orido Nishiki will the variegation return?

Discussion in 'Maples' started by SLR2009, Apr 11, 2020.

  1. SLR2009

    SLR2009 Active Member 10 Years

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    Hi, I grow an Acer palmatum 'Orido Nishiki' in a container. When I bought the tree it had lots of variegation. The following year I fertilized it with a slow release fertilizer and it showed almost no variegation during the growing season. I assume it reverted because I fertilized it. Will the tree be variegated this year or once it reverts it won't ever return?
     
  2. 0soyoung

    0soyoung Well-Known Member

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    I would wager that were you to remove un-variegated leaves in mid- to late-May, they will be replaced by normal variegated leaves in 3 to 6 weeks.

    At any rate, I am quite sure that it has nothing to do with slow release fertilizer.

    I have Ukigumo and Higasayama growing in a inorganic substrate that I fertilize with Osmocote-Plus. Ukigumo sometimes makes some big, almost solid green leaves in its first flush. I do as I described (above) and enjoy nothing but the characteristic almost pure white leaves for the remainder of the growing season. New growth on Higasayama produces ordinary green palmatum leaves on new growth (i.e., it is a normal characteristic). With it too, I do as I described and the ordinary palmate leaves are replaced by the renowned little variegated ones. It is my understanding that this 'reversion' thing is somewhat normal for many acer palmatum varieties, not just variegated ones. Hence my opening remark.
     
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  3. Jaybee63

    Jaybee63 Well-Known Member Maple Society

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    Ditto to everything Osoyoung says.
    Variegation and colouring varies from year to year, some years Marlo, Goshiki Shirdare and Toyama Nishiki look nothing special. Lack of variegation on Toyama and Goshiki Shirdare, typical Palmatum leaves in Marlo.
    The following year they leaf out as expected.
     
  4. Gomero

    Gomero Well-Known Member Maple Society 10 Years

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    All the cultivars in the Oridono nishiki group (Asahi zuru, Diane Verkade, Karasu gawa, Izu no odoriko, Rokugatsuen nishiki, Ilarian, etc.) will lose their variegation as they grow old to become a large, mostly green palmatum. The only way to keep the variegation going is to prune them heavily every year (sort of pollarding), the new growth will be again variegated, but the tree will look ugly.
     
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  5. Atapi

    Atapi Well-Known Member

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    Hi Gomero, I recently heard and learned about the 'Pollarding' technique from a friend when we discussed about Crepe Myrtle pruning. So I was wondered can we do that to the upright Japanese Maple and here you are talking about it. Can you share more how you do yours and do you have any pics of them being pollarding?.
    Thank you so much, steve
     
  6. dicky5ash

    dicky5ash Well-Known Member

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    Very Interesting..at what kind of size do they significantly start loosing variegation or is it a very slow change over many many years.. I have one Oridono nishiki and a Asahi zuru both about 6foot both seem to be heavily variegated atm.. is Beni schichenge in the same group?
     
  7. Gomero

    Gomero Well-Known Member Maple Society 10 Years

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    No, Beni shishihenge is a different kind of variegation, quite stable when it ages. For Oridono, Asahi et similar, it's a slow process. Once they get to 10-15 ft the variegated leaves will be at the end of the branches beyond your field of vision, you will see mostly green leaves. As I said 'they will become mostly green'. Even my 20 years old, 25 ft, Asahi zuru has a few variegated leaves at the tip of the branches but I need a drone to see them.
     
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  8. Gomero

    Gomero Well-Known Member Maple Society 10 Years

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    Hi Atapi, I personally dislike pollarded trees. I just tried once heavily pollarding a Karasu gawa to check out the theory that by doing so you will recover heavy variegation. This is in fact what happened, but the tree looked awful (for me) and have not tried it again.
     
  9. Acerholic

    Acerholic Esteemed Contributor Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout Maple Society

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    I agree with Gomero, I dont like Pollarded trees either. But you find it is a necessity for councils along highways for safety and stopping lorries clipping overhead branches and hence damaging trees and vehicles.
    For us at home it's all about nurturing and shaping our trees from day one. Of course if you have taken over a garden on a house move then it maybe the only option.
     
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  10. SLR2009

    SLR2009 Active Member 10 Years

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    I forgot to mention my Orido Nishiki has been in full sun. Could that be why the variegation wasn't really noticeable? The variegation wasn't really noticeable this year.
     
  11. dicky5ash

    dicky5ash Well-Known Member

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    Apologies I missed your reply to my question back in April..interesting thank you
     
  12. Acerholic

    Acerholic Esteemed Contributor Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout Maple Society

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    @SLR2009 good morning. IMO it really does not matter about position in reverting.
    All will try try to revert to the stronger growth. I have found that it is a constant job every year.
    Can be quite soul-destroying when you miss a shoot that has grown well and it has to be taken out. But it has to be done !!
     
  13. ROEBUK

    ROEBUK Contributor Maple Society

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    They need a good cutting back firstly to get rid of the long whippy growths which in my experience always have the most solid green leafing then i find the majority of the variegation will be forming in the central part of the tree.

    Bought this tree in 2017 as a small mainly green leafed tree and have worked on it every year since, only small minor removal of branches at first, but this is now due for it's first major branch pruning shortly, had a final root trim and re pot late last year so this will now be left alone root and medium wise for the next few years. The colours this year were very good (could be better) but they should improve for next year with planned pruning. Added some pics of it's progress over the years , actually had it in a more sheltered area this year but the winds !! So hopefully will see some more white/cream and pinks and less of the solid greens, plus i don't want the tree to be getting to tall/shrubby etc. The last pic is where i have marked the branches that i will be cutting back, everything past the yellow outline to be taken out.
     

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  14. SLR2009

    SLR2009 Active Member 10 Years

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    ROEBUK how much sunlight does your tree get and did you fertilize it?
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2020
  15. ROEBUK

    ROEBUK Contributor Maple Society

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    This year i moved this to the back of the house which is north facing and only gets the last evening shafts of sunlight for roughly around two hours max that's if we have any sun !! Just usually give a worked in top sprinkling of fish blood and bone meal in the early part of spring just before leaf bud then just leave it alone. Now this year with having it in a different position from last years spot i am interested to see if i will get the lovely fall colours again like last year or weather it will be a bit dull and less showy ? The tree has also suffered from the terrible weather conditions continual rain and very very strong winds which have never seemed to have abated this year , the tree certainly has gone through the grinder this year and is in the process of defoliating but budding back up at a very quick rate i may add and already pushing out new leaf in various places, see pics.
     

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