Please help me identify this tree

Discussion in 'Maples' started by Carnby, Jul 23, 2018.

  1. Carnby

    Carnby Active Member 10 Years

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    Sorry for the poor quality of the pics, but there was too much sun for my smartphone.
    The tree was photographed near Vinci, Leonardo's birthplace, in zone 8b/9a (actually 9a but there is a frost pocket in the immediate neighborhood, due to orography).
    I've never seen such a tree in my area, I think it could be a palmately lobed-leaves cultivar of some more common plant. When I had seen it for the first time, I thought it could be Larix kaempferi or Schinus molle, but it's neither of the two.
    Thanks in advance.
     

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    Last edited: Jul 23, 2018
  2. Daniel Mosquin

    Daniel Mosquin Paragon of Plants UBC Botanical Garden Forums Administrator Forums Moderator 10 Years

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    Alnus glutinosa 'Imperialis', likely.
     
  3. wcutler

    wcutler Paragon of Plants Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

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    I can't tell if the leaves are opposite. If so, the leaves look like maples, either Acer palmatum Dissectum group, or if the leaves and stems have fine hairs (not that you would be able to tell that now), it could be an Acer japonicum 'Aconitifolium'.
     
  4. wcutler

    wcutler Paragon of Plants Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

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    I hadn't seen Daniel's reply. The tree itself looks more like Alnus. But the leaves here are palmately lobed.
    Definitely not maple if the branching and the leaves on the branches are not opposite.
     
  5. Michael F

    Michael F Paragon of Plants Forums Moderator 10 Years

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    Agree not Alnus with those palmately lobed leaves. Some more pics would help.
     
  6. Carnby

    Carnby Active Member 10 Years

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    I wouldn't completely rule out Alnus glutinosa ‘Imperialis’, as suggested above. It is a cultivar I have never seen before and from a Google search it looks quite similar to the specimen I photographed. I will try to get more pics but the tree is planted in a private garden and I'm not sure the owner likes amateur botanists near his property.
     
  7. Silver surfer

    Silver surfer Generous Contributor 10 Years

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    ALNUS  GLUTINOSA  IMPERIALIS 25-07-2009 15-37-50.JPG ALNUS  GLUTINOSA  IMPERIALIS 25-07-2009 15-38-59.JPG
    These pics are from our Alnus glutinosa Imperialis.
    Doesn't look a match to me.
    Leaves look more like Acer...and opposite on the branch as far as I can see.
     
  8. wcutler

    wcutler Paragon of Plants Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

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    You never know. Some people like showing off their rare trees and plants and are delighted to talk about them to someone who shows an interest. It depends how private. Behind a fence, probably not. But I've often taken photos in a front yard hoping an owner would show up and give me the name of something. For a rare ornamental cherry, we knocked on the door and met the owner, who agreed to have her tree in our book.
     
  9. Silver surfer

    Silver surfer Generous Contributor 10 Years

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    tree2.jpg
    Close up of tree in question.
     
  10. Carnby

    Carnby Active Member 10 Years

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    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 24, 2018
  11. wcutler

    wcutler Paragon of Plants Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

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    As you said about the quality of the pics, I'm not sure you can get a definitive ID from what is shown here. I'm going to move this to the Maples forum to see if those folks have anything to say. If they say it's not a maple, I'll move it back.
     
  12. Daniel Mosquin

    Daniel Mosquin Paragon of Plants UBC Botanical Garden Forums Administrator Forums Moderator 10 Years

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    One of the Laciniatum Group of Acer saccharinum cultivars then, perhaps?
     
    emery likes this.
  13. wcutler

    wcutler Paragon of Plants Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

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  14. Michael F

    Michael F Paragon of Plants Forums Moderator 10 Years

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    And also the whitish undersides of the leaves, visible in a few places in the first photo.
     
  15. JT1

    JT1 Contributor

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    Kind of reminds me of Acer palmatum 'Germaine' or 'Germaine's Gyration' grafted on a very tall standard.

    Acer palmatum 'Sekimori' can get very large and unruly with age. Hard to say the cultivar for sure, but it is a dissectum grafted on a very tall standard or understock in my opinion. Quite unique, the tallest understock I ever saw was 12'. Based on the caliper of the understock it must be pretty old.

    But after looking at the pictures again it seems the scale of the leaves are much larger and the bark and color are not right for Acer palmatum. It does all seem right for A.saccharinum f. laciniatum maybe 'Beebe' or 'Skinneri'

    PlantFacts
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2018
  16. emery

    emery Renowned Contributor Maple Society 10 Years

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    Agree it looks like A. saccharinum. There are some very laciniate forms coming from Poland over the last 20 years or so, it could be one of those.
     
  17. Carnby

    Carnby Active Member 10 Years

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    This afternoon has been very hot (36.7 °C/98 °F) in Tuscany, but there was a lot of clouds and pictures were easier to shoot. This is a new closeup of the leaves: definitely a maple (Acer saccharinum f. laciniatum ‘Wieri’?).
     

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    Last edited: Jul 30, 2018

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