Mystery bush

Discussion in 'Plants: Identification' started by Gene, Sep 25, 2003.

  1. Gene

    Gene Member

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    Good day;

    I am new to this forum and would like to be able to identify this bush if possible.

    I am from Nova Scotia, Zone 5,

    The bush in question is deciduous. Green leaved. I am using this bushy plant for hedging material. It is not dense but rather spindly. If I am not mistaken, the bush
    produces a small white flower in spring and produces a purplish/black fruit in the fall which remains on the branches well after the leaves have fallen. The "fruit" does not have any real taste at all and has a pit in the center. The fruit itself is about 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch in diameter.

    Individual plants are currently about 4 ft tall and about 4 feet wide. These have had some prior pruning.

    We purchased these plants before I began keeping records. Now this is one of the few plants growing in my yard which I do not know the name of.

    Thanks
     

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    Last edited: Sep 27, 2003
  2. jimmyq

    jimmyq Well-Known Member 10 Years

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    not a real good close-up picture but I will hazard a guess of Amelanchier, possibly Amelanchier alnifolia. Also known as Saskatoon Serviceberry.
     
  3. Daniel Mosquin

    Daniel Mosquin Paragon of Plants UBC Botanical Garden Forums Administrator Forums Moderator 10 Years

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    It's not an Amelanchier, based on the description of the fruit (although the plant does look similar). Saskatoons definitely have some taste and do not have a pit.

    I think you are correct, though, that it is a member of the rose family, possibly a Prunus.
     
  4. Gene

    Gene Member

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    Different phot

    Thankyou Daniel and Jimmyq for your thoughts so far

    I have scanned a small branch and have also enclosed a ruler. The top of the berry is pressed a little because of the scanner lid


    The flowers are a very small white flower. I cannot remember if they were a grouped flower or single. It does not have any thorns
     

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    Last edited: Sep 27, 2003
  5. Gene

    Gene Member

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    Any new thoughts???

    Anymore thoughts with the new photo??????

    Thanks for your input so far.


    Gene
     
  6. Eric La Fountaine

    Eric La Fountaine Contributor Forums Moderator 10 Years

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    The berries look like Gaultheria Shallon. Are they lightly fuzzy? Are the leaves thick?
     
  7. Gene

    Gene Member

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    Eric;

    Thanks for getting back. The berries are completely smooth and will remain on the bush in a shrivelled form all through the winter. The leaves are just a normal garden variety thin leaf and will all fall from the plant during the fall
     
  8. Daniel Mosquin

    Daniel Mosquin Paragon of Plants UBC Botanical Garden Forums Administrator Forums Moderator 10 Years

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    The plant isn't Gaultheria shallon - again, not a pitted fruit.

    I've discussed this with Douglas Justice, Curator of Collections at the garden. He's suggested something within the Rhamnaceae (the buckthorn family), pointing out that the leaves of the plant on close examination lacked stipules from what he can tell from the scan. This eliminates Prunus as a possibility, which I quickly agreed with, noting that I couldn't think of any Prunus that had a tasteless fruit (wild plums or chokecherries, anyone?).

    Looking at Gleason and Cronquist's "Manual of Vascular Plants of Northeastern United States and Adjacent Canada" and closely at your image, Douglas and I suggest Rhamnus cathartica, also known as the common buckthorn. Reasons for this include the number of lateral veins of each side of the midvein of the leaf (2-4, and mostly 3) plus the fact that is common in cultivation.

    To confirm, can you let us know if the plant has short thorns on the end of some of its branches? If it doesn't, it may be a similar species, perhaps Rhamnus frangula.

    Here's a link with more information:

    Plant Conservation Alliance (Alien Plant Working Group) - common buckthorn
     
  9. Gene

    Gene Member

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    The leaves are not a dark glossy green, rather a light to medium green with a dull shine. The leaves turn rather early in the fall as seen below. Some branches are almost completely denuded of leaves at this stage. Other branches/leaves vary in color from their summer green to yellow to orange to red. There are no thorns at the end of the branches nor is there any fuzziness to the underside of the leaves as seen below.


    The branch on the extreme right shows the under side of the leaves and a few berries which still cling to the branch

    The middle branch shows the summer green colors

    The branch on the left shows the fall colors


    These bushes currently define the lower part of my driveway and are situated underneath some wild native poplar and maples. They are in a part shade area.
    The bushes are not dense nor thick but rather spindly and leggy in this area. I do believe they would do somewhat better with more sunshine. There appears to be some black leaf rot or similar disease on some of its leaves which may be attributed to a lack of sun???
     

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    Last edited: Oct 9, 2003
  10. Gene

    Gene Member

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    Daniel;

    Any other thoughts with the new photo???

    Thanks

    Gene

     
  11. Gene

    Gene Member

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    Does anyone have any new thoughts after having seen this new photo???

    Thanks

    Gene






     
  12. Daniel Mosquin

    Daniel Mosquin Paragon of Plants UBC Botanical Garden Forums Administrator Forums Moderator 10 Years

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    Well, I'm stymied. I've so far not been able to get all the facts to assemble into something that it could possibly be. Complicating matters is that you mentioned that you purchased it, so it could be something European that is related to the North American species and actually does fit all the facts.

    Currently, I'm thinking it might be a member of the Ericaceae or heath family.

    Its leaves are similar to Gaylussacia baccata (via Fa. C. Esveld Nursery in Holland), and Gaylussacia baccata also has fruit that is a drupe (i.e., a fruit with a "pit"). Unfortunately, it also has pinkish-red flowers and the fruit is (on some websites) described as being sweet. Its common name is black huckleberry. (Another photograph of
    Gaylussacia baccata , this time from the Univ of Minnesota.)

    Gaylussacia dumosa does have white flowers, but its fruit is a berry. The description of Gaylussacia dumosa from the North Carolina State University Department of Botany is potentially helpful, particularly the part about the leaf tip being abruptly acute.

    And, while the leaves are similar to Gaylussacia I've looked at, the leaves are even more similar to Vaccinium, but I don't think any of the fruit of the blueberries or their closest relatives have pits.

    So, a few questions to maybe see if this is on the right track:

    Are the white flowers pure-white or pinkish-white?
    Are the flowers shaped like an urn? Or are they flowers with distinctive petals?
    Do the plants have noticeable glands, i.e., is there anything sticky about the plant? For example, the fruit, new stem growth, the leaves or petioles.
     

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