Large Tree - Please help identify it

Discussion in 'Plants: Identification' started by aranlanning, Jul 23, 2007.

  1. aranlanning

    aranlanning Member

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    13 years ago we moved houses and inherited two large trees in our back garden. To this day we still dont know what they are - our neighbour (who has now moved) was a Doctor and specialist in plants and animals but couldnt tell us what the tree was called either. So Ive found this forum and am hoping someone knows what it is when I describe it. Its a rare tree I THINK - theres another in the City Centre but the Council didnt know what it was either. Usless...

    After my neighbour moved away - one of our trees obviously spread its seed and our new neighbours now have the same species of tree sprouting in their garden (and its groing fast)

    Description....

    - Height - Its a tall tree - they both stand next to a Silver Birch in our garden and they're thaller than that.

    - It doesnt have the chunkiest of appearances - its got a narrow trunk with flimsy branches and doesnt exactly get covered in leaves.

    - Its a late bloomer, they are usually the last two trees in our neighbourhood to get their leaves in the summer - and lose them easily (and thus usually first) when winter arrives (when they look DEAD due to their tall narrow flimsy appearance!)

    - The branches have sharp THORNS on them and they grow on the Trunk too in places.

    - The most telling clue is that they flower in late May/early June time for about 2 weeks. They come out in nice smelling clusters of white scented flowers.

    - Lastly its leaves are very light green in colour and its structure (i believe this is what you call it) is a "twice compound leaf".

    The closest ive got with my search is the Honey Locust but am still not convinced it i the Honey Locust Tree.

    ANY thoughts or suggestions would be so muchly appreciated. Its bugged us on and off for years.

    (ps if I can get a photo up shortly I will) but talk away and I'll check back tomorrow with anticipation!
     
  2. Dave-Florida

    Dave-Florida Active Member

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  3. Michael F

    Michael F Paragon of Plants Forums Moderator 10 Years

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    I'd agree you've very likely got a Honeylocust there, it is planted fairly frequently as an ornamental tree in southern England.

    You are lucky to have it flowering, probably a result of the very hot summer last year (what a distant memory that is now!!). The summers in most of Britain are usually too cold to promote flowering in Honeylocust. I guess you can be sure it won't flower next year!
     
  4. aranlanning

    aranlanning Member

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    Thankyou both for your replies. Im becoming more convinced they are Honey Locusts (or at least some form of the species). Especially what Michael said about its flowering habits...

    For the first 6 years we lived here - they didnt flower. So you can imagine our shock one morning to look out the back window and see both trees with white flowers all over them. We couldnt understand it and thats when we assumed that the trees were foreign (we'd already come to that conclusion when they got their leaves alot later than the Maples/Beeches/Birches/Horse Chestnuts that were in our vacinity.

    For the past 7 years they have flowered every summer though - admittedly the hottest summer we've had here for a while was last summer and they literally burst with white flowers that you could barely see the green.

    I'll take a photo tomorrow just to confirm.

    Thanks again!
     
  5. Michael F

    Michael F Paragon of Plants Forums Moderator 10 Years

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    Hmmm . . . I'm having doubts now! Honeylocust flowers, while scented, are not white:
    http://project.bio.iastate.edu/trees/campustrees/Gleditsia_fl.html

    Others to check are Black Locust (Robinia pseudoacacia), and Pagoda Tree (Styphnolobium japonicum, a.k.a. Sophora japonica). They both have white flowers, though the Black Locust should have finished flowering by now.

    Black Locust flowers: http://www.missouriplants.com/Whitealt/Robinia_pseudo_acacia_page.html

    Pagoda Tree flowers: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:PagodaTreeFlowers.jpg
     
  6. aranlanning

    aranlanning Member

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    OK heres a photo I took last summer of it when they were in Flower. Honey Locust or not? You can zoom in a bit to see it better (if it allows you too)....
     

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  7. saltcedar

    saltcedar Rising Contributor 10 Years

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    Robinia pseudoacacia, Black locust.

    HTH
    Chris
     
  8. aranlanning

    aranlanning Member

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    Thanks everyone! Mystery appears to have been solved. They ARE Black Locusts (also know as False Acacia apparently). Just looked up the Black Locust on the Internet and it seems almost certain, looking at the pics on the Web of the tree that we do have that species!

    They are a quite magnificent trees (most in Britain are pretty bland really), so its great to finally be able to give them a name!

    Thanks again!
    Aran
     
  9. smivies

    smivies Active Member

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    And the 'seedlings' in your new neighbours yard are most likely root sprouts. While attractive, they are good colonizers and may become a nuisance.
     
  10. aranlanning

    aranlanning Member

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    Smivies - i dont think it is a "root sprout" as you call it - we've had these before - they come up in the middle of our lawn every now and then and are attached to the roots of the taller of the two trees (the one with less flowers on in the photo).

    Our neighbour's tree appears to be a tree in its own right - looking at the photo i posted, it is directly behind the tree with more flowers on situated behind the Greenhouse but the other side of the wooden fence - this is why the tree with more flowers on looks much bushier than its twin to the right - its an illusion - its the "baby" behind it making it look bushier! Its now about half the height of the other two so probably is a true sappling not linked to the roots of the other two.
     
  11. smivies

    smivies Active Member

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    That may be the case but Black Locust propagates preferentially (but not exclusively)by root sprouts and quickly forms monocultures, especially on disturbed sites. I would be very surprised if the neighbour's tree was a seed grown specimen.
     
  12. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

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    Honeylocust doesn't have noticeable white flowers, so it turning out to be something else not a surprise. The leaves of honeylocust also have more divisions than those of black locust, and the branches of black locust have stout curved spines. Honeylocust may have branching thorns on the trunk, although many trees planted during more recent times belong to thornless var. inermis.

    Deeply fissured bark of black locust also distinctive.
     
  13. KarinL

    KarinL Well-Known Member 10 Years

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    Regarding your first paragraph - that's what a root sprout is; a new plant growing from the roots of the original. They can grow to tree size.
     

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