Identification: Is this 'Ukon' or 'Gyoiko'?

Discussion in 'Ornamental Cherries' started by wcutler, Apr 19, 2019.

  1. wcutler

    wcutler Esteemed Contributor Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

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    Kimiyo Kamimura wrote to @Douglas Justice to report finding trees on Ontario at 18th that seem to be 'Gyoiko'. We have had these on our map as 'Ukon'. There are a some other locations over the years that have been reported by scouts as 'Gyoiko' because of the green stripes, but they haven't succeeded (yet) in making their case. I took a lot of photos of these trees on Ontario today, so I will post a lot of them. I didn't notice anything different from one tree to the next, was just taking photos randomly, but then I decided I should try to keep flowers and trees together, so first I will post three of the trees in separate postings. Here is the group.
    20190419_Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_165505.jpg 20190419_Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_170549.jpg

    This is the middle of five trees, at 3456 Ontario. All these trees had some flower clusters that were fairly evenly cream-coloured, and some that had a lot of green.
    20190419_3456Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_171136.jpg 20190419_3456Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_170802.jpg 20190419_3456Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_170836.jpg 20190419_3456Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_170850.jpg 20190419_3456Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_170903.jpg 20190419_3456Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_171012.jpg 20190419_3456Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_171039.jpg 20190419_3456Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_171100.jpg
     
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2019
  2. wcutler

    wcutler Esteemed Contributor Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

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    20190419_3468Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_171423.jpg 20190419_3468Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_171217.jpg 20190419_3468Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_171237.jpg 20190419_3468Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_171257.jpg 20190419_3468Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_171345.jpg
     
  3. wcutler

    wcutler Esteemed Contributor Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

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    20190419_3482Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_171701.jpg 20190419_3482Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_171520.jpg 20190419_3482Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_171528.jpg 20190419_3482Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_171538.jpg 20190419_3482Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_171611.jpg 20190419_3482Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_171555.jpg 20190419_3482Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_171602.jpg
     
  4. wcutler

    wcutler Esteemed Contributor Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

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    Here are some other photos from this group, but I did not record which tree was which.
    20190419_Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_165537.jpg 20190419_Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_165608.jpg 20190419_Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_165619.jpg 20190419_Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_165629.jpg 20190419_Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_165716.jpg 20190419_Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_165925.jpg 20190419_Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_170034.jpg 20190419_Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_170108.jpg 20190419_Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_170215.jpg 20190419_Ontario18th_Ukon-or-Gyoiko_Cutler_20190419_170250.jpg
     
  5. wcutler

    wcutler Esteemed Contributor Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

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    Maybe I'll collect here some links to questionnable 'Ukon'/'Gyoiko' trees as I come across them in postings.
    @Junglekeeper posted two trees, one with essentially no stripes, one with stripes about a block away from the other, at 2795 West 37th Ave:
    Arbutus Ridge and Arbutus Ridge
    I posted three trees on Highbury at 31st:
    Dunbar-Southlands
    Lisa L posted the group at QE Park near 33rd:
    Riley Park
    The tree that first had us wondering, on Barclay Street; we thought it did not look entirely like the Stanley Park tree that we are calling 'Gyoiko'.
    West End / Stanley Park
    I posted these at 7th and Sasamat, in an Ornamental Cherries thread that went back and forth several times.
    Identification: - Asagi, Kizakura, Gyoiko and Ukon - Greenish white doubles, bronze leaves, mid-season
     
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2019
  6. yaletowner

    yaletowner Active Member

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    Per the guidebook, here are the aspects I would look at:
    1. buds a) reddish or b) greenish
    2. calyx tube a) bulb like or b) tapered
    3. individual flowers a) 4.5 cm across or b) 5.0-5.5 cm across
    4. centre of blossom a) reddish or b) greenish
    I am inclined to say there might be both varieties there but without a ruler on the blossom, I think per #3 more information is needed. Could go either way with the data provided.
     
  7. Anne Eng

    Anne Eng Active Member 10 Years

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    I was just at 3482 Ontario/18th to look at these trees.

    I can't see how there could be any confusion that they're Ukon.

    Not with the grass-green stripes and the extra pink stripe visible in the fallen petals. Clearly, they are at one with the "green, white, and pink...coloured court-robes...of the women in the imperial court of ancient Japan..." (Japanese Flowering Cherries, Wybe Kuitert, p. 351-352. Gyoiko > "coloured court-robes").

    If I were a woman in the court of old Japan, I would certainly feel kinship with this cherry. Even if it contains a mutation that causes green (photosynthetic) tissue in the petals.

    20190420_Ontario18th_Gyoiko_Eng_4158.jpg 20190420_Ontario18th_Gyoiko_Eng_4159.jpg 20190420_Ontario18th_Gyoiko_Eng_4161.jpg 20190420_Ontario18th_Gyoiko_Eng_4163.jpg
     
  8. Anne Eng

    Anne Eng Active Member 10 Years

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    Yes, there can be much-a-muck confusion about Ukon.

    We must blame Steve Wysall. These are my photos from his Japan tour in 2014 to Hamarikyu Gardens in Tokyo. The "Ukon" there has blossoms that look a lot like those of the tree at 3482 Ontario/18.
    image.png thumbnail_image.png thumbnail_image (1).png


    I then went to check into current information and photos on Gyo-i-ko:

    https://www.botanic.jp/plants-ka/gyoiko_2.jpg
    gyoiko_2.jpg

    The Flowers of Konan Ward 新潟市
    The double-flowered cherry tree variety Gyoiko features unusual light green blossoms that bloom from late April to early May. Many people come out to see these blossoms.
    Three Gyoiko trees are planted on the banks of the Kitayama-ike Pond. Right beside them grow double-flowered cherry trees with pink blossoms, making the pale green petals of Gyoiko stand out even more. This rare sight draws many visitors who spend hours gazing at the blossoms and taking photos. Within a few days of opening up, the green cherry blossoms turn red at their center.

    https://www.kankou-shimane.com/en/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/IMG_0866.jpg

    Gyoiko_0866.jpg

    OK, the dark red centres, combined with the green striping and creamy background petal colour, does seem to better lend itself to courtly robe imitation. So maybe this is what Gyo-i-ko should look like, and the other, but a pale imitation, and is really a not-what-we're-used-to-seeing-but-nonetheless-Ukon.

    Even a cherry tree has its ups and downs.
     

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