Is it rare for Marsh Forget-me-not (myosotis scorpioides) to have six petal blossoms?

Discussion in 'Pacific Northwest Native Plants' started by dustie, Sep 12, 2019.

  1. dustie

    dustie New Member

    Messages:
    17
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    oregon
    Hi.
    This is my first attempt at this forum, so hopefully it goes without my messing up in the format. I am not much experienced at the identification of plants, either, so hopefully I don't make a mess of the terminologies.

    These flowers made me curious, and I've searched quite a few sites to see what is mentioned of the plant. In the searching, eventually I found this site from a link in another site.
    It appears, from what I've been able to find, this is the Marsh Forget-me-not (myosotis scorpioides). Every place I have found it mentioned, it is only stated the flowers are five-petaled and no other variants are mentioned.
    As shown in the photos, there are five petaled and six-petaled flowers carried on the same main stem. Is this so uncommon it does not receive mention in literature about them? Or, is this a different plant than what I have mentioned here?

    The plants are growing at the lower edge of the Oregon Cascades eastern foothills, northwest of Bend, south of Black Butte, at approx. 3150-3200 feet elevation. They grow both in pockets of calm water at the edge of a stream channel and in very moist, boggy ground in low spots just outside the water of the stream. The stream runs through predominantly Ponderosa Pine forest with some aspens and deciduous brush mixed in along the stream.

    The stem pictured meaures about 38+ inches in length when it is straightened, and is a pretty fair average length of the plants where it was. The material I've found on the Marsh Forget-me-not seems to indicate 24 inches is usually the longest it grows.
    Photos 1 and 2 were taken in mid-August. The others were taken around the 8th-11th of September.
    I sincerely apologize if the image quality of the photos produced by my low quality camera makes it difficult to evaluate. Hopefully, I've followed the guidelines well enough, of what should be included in the photos.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. Daniel Mosquin

    Daniel Mosquin Esteemed Contributor UBC Botanical Garden Forums Administrator Forums Moderator 10 Years

    Messages:
    9,834
    Likes Received:
    302
    Location:
    Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Is it rare? Good question. Like you said, most places will only mention the 5-petal standard version. The work that is most likely to document variation, Flora of North America, doesn't have its Boraginaceae treatments available yet.

    That said, petal number variation for some groups is a relatively common mutation--consider that there are a number of cultivated plants where petal numbers are doubled, tripled, or more.

    Looking at the Oregon Flora site, M. scorpioides has been collected from the locale, and I am almost certain it isn't any of the other species that have been documented there. Stem length is another variable thing, in part because lack of light can cause etiolation (inducing stem growth between nodes in order to attempt to reach more light)
     
  3. dustie

    dustie New Member

    Messages:
    17
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    oregon

    Thank you for the insights.
    The pursuit of chasing the curiosity about those flowers resulted in my finding this site. This site has begun to make me more curious about identifying plants.
    In reading what those of you who really know what you're talking about write in comments, I feel like I've been deposited on another planet among creatures of some much higher life forms. Please don't take that the wrong way....it's only a statement of how over-awed I am by the bigness of it all....don't know how much I'm missing out of all that just easily goes over my head.
     
  4. Daniel Mosquin

    Daniel Mosquin Esteemed Contributor UBC Botanical Garden Forums Administrator Forums Moderator 10 Years

    Messages:
    9,834
    Likes Received:
    302
    Location:
    Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    You don't need to be too humble. One of the best skills to have with respect to identifying plants is the ability to observe small details. I can guarantee few people would ever notice the 5-petal / 6-petal difference.
     
  5. dustie

    dustie New Member

    Messages:
    17
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    oregon
    Ok.
    Thank you.
     
  6. wcutler

    wcutler Esteemed Contributor Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

    Messages:
    7,653
    Likes Received:
    505
    Location:
    Vancouver, BC Canada
    I'll add that you can stop apologizing for anything. Your posting was perfect:
    • You did some prior research
    • You used a subject line that will help you find your posting again (you read and followed the guidelines!)
    • You gave the location of the plant
    • You included photos and they were nice and clear
    • You posted several photos with different aspects
    • You included an indication of the size
    • You described what you saw and what you want to know
    Ask us more! A new posting for each plant is good.
     
  7. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

    Messages:
    19,951
    Likes Received:
    228
    Location:
    WA USA (Z8)
    And be sure to remember all the points in Wendy's bulleted list.

    In other words forget it not.
     
  8. wcutler

    wcutler Esteemed Contributor Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

    Messages:
    7,653
    Likes Received:
    505
    Location:
    Vancouver, BC Canada
    Ha-ha.
    Where are the emojis when we need them?
     
  9. dustie

    dustie New Member

    Messages:
    17
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    oregon
    You are so kind. Thank you.

    One side question on posting a new thread.
    There was a box to insert tags. I entered the name of the flower, and a message came back it could not be accepted as a tag.
    Obviously the thread successfully posted without a tag, so tags are an optional item? I believe I don't know their correct usage.
     
  10. dustie

    dustie New Member

    Messages:
    17
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    oregon
    Advice/instruction duly noted, thank you.

    You are TOO funny....erhhmm...punny!
     
  11. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

    Messages:
    19,951
    Likes Received:
    228
    Location:
    WA USA (Z8)
    At an electronics products trade show in Tokyo.
     
  12. Georgia Strait

    Georgia Strait Active Member

    Messages:
    710
    Likes Received:
    74
    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, BC Canada
    Hello Dustie - what a pretty part of Oregon

    QUESTION - is that a dime (10 cent piece) in your photos for this and the juniper ?

    Canadians might not recognize the people on the coins (plus we have 1$ and 2$ coins instead of paper bills)

    Your posts are very interesting
    On thé Juniper post DANIEL mentioned a brand of nature guides ;Timber Press.

    I also like the Lone Pine guides tho I am not sure if they reach as far as Oregon.

    Www.lonepinepublishing.com
     
  13. wcutler

    wcutler Esteemed Contributor Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

    Messages:
    7,653
    Likes Received:
    505
    Location:
    Vancouver, BC Canada
    Thanks for asking about that, dustie; I'm sorry I didn't pick up on it when you first asked. What exactly did you try to enter? I've added forget-me-not with the hyphens and the botanical name as two words with a space, so that doesn't seem to be the problem. Can people still under moderation not add tags? I don't know the answer to that.

    Tags are optional, and almost no-one seems to use them. Words in the text get picked up on searches, so those words are not all that necessary as tags. But sometimes I notice that a word associated with a plant was not mentioned, or a useful common name or botanical name is missing in the text of the postings in a thread, so I will add those words as tags. If you think someone might want to find your thread using some word that doesn't really fit into your posting, it would be useful then to add that word as a tag.
     
  14. dustie

    dustie New Member

    Messages:
    17
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    oregon
    Thanks for your comment and reading recommendation, Georgia.

    That is a U.S. dime in the photo, so, approximately 18mm. At the time, the thought did cross my mind that a dime may not be recognized by all who see the photos, but it was something that was handy in my pocket. Thank you for pointing out that it may not be a universally recognized object for size reference.
     
  15. dustie

    dustie New Member

    Messages:
    17
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    oregon
    Thank you, Wendy, for the comment.
    At the time I was uncertain if the tags were necessary or optional.

    What had I tried to enter? As I recall it was:
    Marsh Forget-Me-Not, myosotis scorpiodes

    Turns out it seems to basically be a non-issue, anyway, so I was just not certain the usually preferred practice concerning adding tags. You have clarified it nicely. Thank you.
     

Share This Page