Identification: If these are corymbs, then can this be 'Somei-yoshino'?

Discussion in 'Ornamental Cherries' started by wcutler, Apr 9, 2010.

  1. wcutler

    wcutler Esteemed Contributor Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

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    Scouts Laura and Mary Ellen and I did the Cambie median today, to write down the names from all the new cherry tree tags. But what got our attention were all these old trees that we've been identifying as 'Somei-yoshino', that still had more blossoms than we'd have expected, and that I thought showed a corymb inflorescence. But our Ornamental Cherries in Vancouver book and Kuitert's Japanese Flowering Cherries both say that 'Somei-yoshino' and 'Akebono' have 3- to 4- flowered umbels.

    So the first question is: have I misunderstood what a corymb is? These are umbels?
    20100409_Cambie38th_Somei-yoshinoQ_Cutler_P1000245.jpg 20100409_Cambie38th_Somei-yoshinoQ_Cutler_P1000247.jpg 20100409_Cambie38th_Somei-yoshinoQ_Cutler_P1000253.jpg
    20100409_Cambie38th_Somei-yoshinoQ_Cutler_P1000266.jpg 20100409_Cambie38th_Somei-yoshinoQ_Cutler_P1000275.jpg 20100409_Cambie38th_Somei-yoshinoQ_Cutler_P1000279.jpg 20100409_Cambie38th_Somei-yoshinoQ_Cutler_P1000286.jpg
    Here's a young 'Akebono' that seemed to have the same structure.
    20100409_Cambie38th_Akebono_Cutler_P1000288.jpg

    If they're umbels, then I'm happy calling them 'Somei-yoshino'. But if they're corymbs, then the second question is: Are they 'Somei-yoshino' with corymbs or if not, what are they?
    20100409_Cambie38th_Somei-yoshinoQ_Cutler_P1000257.jpg
     
  2. Douglas Justice

    Douglas Justice Active Member UBC Botanical Garden Forums Administrator Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout Maple Society 10 Years

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    Well, I'm a bit puzzled, but I suspect that we're still looking at 'Somei-yoshino'. This year has been more than a bit strange with respect to weather, and the endless traffic and construction over the past couple of years has clearly had an effect. It isn't outside the realm of possibility that 4 weeks on, aberrant inflorescences might elongate sufficiently to show a peduncle. On the other hand, that's quite a peduncle!
     
  3. wcutler

    wcutler Esteemed Contributor Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

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    I have some more peduncles, and I have a query about whether other 'Somei-yoshino' are the same thing. I was going to start a new thread titled "Will the real 'Somei-yoshino' please stand up", but it's really a continuation of this one.

    So I'll start with the ones whose flowers reminded me of the ones that started this thread. Here's a tree near the heronry.
    20120409_HeronryGlen_Somei-yoshino_Cutler_P1200375.jpg 20120409_HeronryGlen_Somei-yoshino_Cutler_P1200379.jpg

    This tree is very near the two beautiful 'Shirotae' at Lost Lagoon.
    20120409_LostLagoon_Somei-yoshino_Cutler_P1200480.jpg 20120409_LostLagoon_Somei-yoshino_Cutler_P1200482.jpg 20120409_LostLagoon_Somei-yoshino_Cutler_P1200488.jpg 20120409_LostLagoon_Somei-yoshino_Cutler_P1200491.jpg 20120409_LostLagoon_Somei-yoshino_Cutler_P1200492.jpg

    This tree at the Planetarium seemed different to me because the branches are not slim and graceful, particularly compared to the the previous tree, which is unlikely to be any younger. The last photo is Sue Wagner's.
    20120401_Planetarium_Somei-yoshino_Cutler_P1190992.jpg 20120401_Planetarium_Somei-yoshino_Cutler_P1190997.jpg 20120401_Planetarium_Somei-yoshino_Cutler_P1190999-o.jpg 20120402_Planetarium_Somei-yoshino_Wagner_P1010733.jpg

    But then I noticed that the branches of the 'Somei-yoshino' trees on 64th at French looked similar to the Planetarium one.
    20120406_64thFrenchCartier_Somei-yoshino_Cutler_P1200211.jpg 20120406_64thFrenchCartier_Somei-yoshino_Cutler_P1200226.jpg 20120406_64thFrenchCartier_Somei-yoshino_Cutler_P1200214c.jpg

    Where my two different trees theory falls apart is that the Cambie St tree that started this thread seems to have the same coarseness of the branches as the Planetarium and 64th Ave trees - is that just disease?
     
  4. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

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    I would think those last were 'Akebono'.
     
  5. Douglas Justice

    Douglas Justice Active Member UBC Botanical Garden Forums Administrator Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout Maple Society 10 Years

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    I was looking at a number of 'Akebono' on my way along Marine Drive this morning, and it occurred to me that the differences between specimens, in terms of flower colour and phenology (timing) is sometimes significant. In most cases, the youngest of the 'Akebono' trees open their flowers earlier and generally all at once, compared with older specimens.

    This makes me wonder about the nature and flow of solutes in these trees, and the implications for organ development. Perhaps it's just a function of the length of the vasculature between the root tip and the branch tip (older tree: further to travel), but maybe it has to do with microbial associations in the soil or in the plants themselves.

    For example, plants with mycorrhizal fungal associations (mycorrhizae naturally associate with the roots of vascular plants) are generally less stressed and have greater access to moisture and nutrients (particularly phosphorus). I'll have to check again to see if the bland coloured 'Akebono' trees are in healthy looking lawns. Heavily fertilized lawns typically have less significant populations of mycorrhizae, and vigorous grasses compete more effectively for resources.

    Grafted plants might have vascular constrictions at the graft union, and I expect that older trees will have accumulated a number of viruses and microbes that might affect the nature of the solutes in the xylem. Verticillium, which is a vascular wilt disease, is pathogenic on Prunus (though not typically fatal) and probably clogs the vasculature to some extent. I suspect that this would have an affect on the quality and quantity of the solutes reaching the expanding flowers.

    Too many questions, I know, but maybe the most beautiful trees are "diseased."
     
  6. wcutler

    wcutler Esteemed Contributor Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

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    The last set were posted this year and last in Marpole (click the Marpole link upper right in posting if you want to see the whole thread). I finally agreed with Shirley and Kenny that they're 'Somei-yoshino', based partly on the fact that 'Akebono' were still mostly in bud in that neighbourhood. The same is true for the Planetarium tree - no 'Akebono' in that area had flowers open.
     
  7. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

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    Not so pink when the pictures are enlarged.
     
  8. wcutler

    wcutler Esteemed Contributor Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout 10 Years

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    Douglas, I'm assuming you're not saying you think these are 'Akebono', right? 'Akebono' variation just got you thinking about variation in any cultivar, including 'Somei-yoshino' like all of these?
     
  9. Douglas Justice

    Douglas Justice Active Member UBC Botanical Garden Forums Administrator Forums Moderator VCBF Cherry Scout Maple Society 10 Years

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    Yes, sorry, I was just ruminating in print.
     

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