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Discussion in 'Rosa (roses)' started by 1950Greg, Jun 13, 2009.
Eddies Crimson (1956 Canada) Bred by J.H. Eddie
Looks like 'Eddie's Jewel' to me. 'Eddie's Crimson' produces a busier flower, often with deformed petals in the center. I'm growing both 'Eddie's Crimson' and 'Eddie's Jewel' on Camano Island. The 'Eddie's Crimson' is grafted on a sweetbriar and has grown several yards across after only a small number of years.
I once saw an 'Eddie's Jewel' in a rosarian's garden on Mercer Island that I estimated to be about 20' x 20' in size. This cultivar has been sold in North America under various wrong names, including 'Geranium', Rosa macrophylla and 'Regalia'. Quite a few years ago now I got my first plants (from a local outlet that I believe received them from Pickerings nursery, Ontario) as 'Geranium', planted them in the other garden north of Seattle. I soon saw they were not 'Geranium', began trying to discover what they might actually be instead. The misidentification R. macrophylla was used by a small local grower supplying local garden centers. Since I have seen a photo of an 'Eddie's Jewel' growing out of a boulder at the International Rose Test Garden, Portland, Oregon mis-captioned in a rose book as that species perhaps this collection is where that mistake originated. Before I settled on 'Eddie's Jewel' with some confidence a plant I supplied to Heronswood nursery was propagated and sold for a short time as 'Regalia'. I was asked beforehand if I thought this would be acceptable, since I was still not certain the plant was 'Eddie's Jewel' I did not say it was a bad idea.
After seeing this plant growing it took a while to come to the idea that it might be one or the other of J.H. Eddie's creations. I looked at both Edddie's Crimson and Eddies Jewell and after loolking at both sets of pictures posted at Help Me Find site I thought the ones of Eddie's Crimson looked the closest. Have a look at these two photos from HMF and see what you think. http://www.helpmefind.com/plant/l.php?l=21.23925 http://www.helpmefind.com/plant/l.php?l=21.15117
I have looked at all photos and descriptions - including those in rose books - I was aware of for years and used those to arrive at my current determinations. The 'Eddie's Crimson' here was received as such from a nursery, which apparently was offering the true item as it fits the bill.
With cultivars such as these a possible way to check to see if what is being grown some years down the line is true to type is to find the original catalog descriptions and see if these give illuminating details. Of course, you have to find copies in a collection somewhere - and the first listings may not provide diagnostically useful information.
With these two you would want Eddie's listings to say things like which one had the busier flower etc. That is the main difference between them - 'Eddie's Jewel' is the one that looks single (occasional flowers have an extra petal, apparently accounting for descriptions calling it semi-double).
This year I have also noticed that 'Eddie's Crimson' has already mostly gone over whereas 'Eddie's Jewel' is still presenting a solid display.
Possibly the catalog collection at Van Dusen has an old Eddie catalog or two, or maybe there are some catalog files at UBC.
After trying to track down a number of unknown roses I some times wonder if there are to many being bred.
Hybrid bedding roses are highly numerous and often ephemeral. But other types like these two Eddie hybrids may be more lasting, some old garden roses may be truly ancient. So you have quite an accumulation of cultivars over the centuries.
GardenWeb has a rose identification forum if that holds any interest.