HEY HEY HEY !!! Check out my Etrogs!!

Discussion in 'Citrus' started by ronenzzz, Dec 7, 2006.

  1. ronenzzz

    ronenzzz Member

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    Hey people,

    You may remeber me for writing a post asking for help with growing Etrogs from seed.

    Well guess what . .

    I did it!!!

    Yes its true ladies and germs I have 4 etrog plants now. They are at my work and check out the story and pics.

    I planted them in little pots at my work. And after a while i started to get upset cause nothing was happening. So i started to dig up the seeds and when i did, i saw that they had sprouted but since they were burried too deep they werent breaking the ground surface. So i dug them out and they turned green right away.

    Now i brought i good light bulb from home wich is used in aquariums with plants.

    Now the fun part.

    In order to keep the plants warm i have them situatedon top of old networking equipment. 1 hub that doesnt work and one checkpoint firewall appliance. They produce heat but not oo much.

    and the plant are doing great.

    Now can anyone give me advice at this point? Is there anything i should be doing?

    how about fertilizer?

    i have some 20 20 20

    should i use that?

    Thanks for the help!!!!

    Ronen
     

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  2. skeeterbug

    skeeterbug Active Member

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    Congratulations Ronen! They do need fertilizer and trace minerals to grow properly. Container grown plants should be fertilized with 5-1-3 NPK ratio.

    Skeet
     
  3. BabyBlue11371

    BabyBlue11371 Active Member

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    Congrats Ronen! I started a couple of Etrog seeds same time and then made the mistake of divideing them when two sprouts came from each seed. It killed them.. I was too rough and broke the roots.. Yours look wonderful!!!
    Gina *BabyBlue*
     
  4. K Baron

    K Baron Well-Known Member

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    Never heard of Etrogs but hey that's why I love this site.... now if you give your plants


    natural bright light and old off on the fertilizer at least until they are 15 cm tall , I think you

    will have them around for years... and using the requisite 5-1-3 NPK fert. mix....

    Then wait for blooms and fruit and years later, a grove of citrus.....I am still waiting....
     
  5. PhillyPalms

    PhillyPalms Active Member

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    You did good. You must have a cool boss. Don't quit that gig.
     
  6. ronenzzz

    ronenzzz Member

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    Thanks for all the supportive feedback.

    Regarding my boss, its actually bosses. Three of them.
    Typical Israeli company.

    And they are all jerks (sorry for the negative note).

    And one of them has complained about the setup alreay.

    I told him the equipment doesnt work, is not supported anymore, and was headed for the trash bin.

    He still said he didnt like it etc etc.

    What to do.

    Just ignoring him.

    Ill keep you all posted.
     
  7. Millet

    Millet Well-Known Member 10 Years

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    I most definitely would NOT withhold fertilizer from your Etrogs until they reach 6 inches (15 cm). Nutrition during the propagation phase (seeding or rooting). and druing the first weeks/months is extremely important. The benefits from early nutrition have a long carry over well past transplantiing, and is a separate factor from the quantity of fertilizer added to the mix after transplanting into the next container. The inability of a seedling to overcome the influence of poor nutrition during the earliest stages of growth cannot be over emphasized. On average adding 67 to 151 grams of Osmocote 18-6-12 slow release fertilizer (no substitutes) per cubic foot of germinating mix produces a 200% increase in height of seedlings plus a superior develop of the lateral buds. Some people try to "save" stunted seedlings by providing a nutritional environment following transplanting into the next larger container but the early advantage has already been lost. Nutrition added during propagation increases growth of all tree species. The greatest nutritional response is from phosphorus. If the optimum level of phosphorus is provided, the levels of nitrogen and potassium become somewhat less critical as long as they ARE PROVIDED. The set back trees sustain due to the privation of nutrition, or from poor nutrition during seeding or rooting, as opposed to trees that are supplied with the proper nutrition placed directly in the germinating medium, continues well into the seventh month after transplanting. Trace minerals (STEM or Micromax) should be added into the germinating mix at 13 grams to 17 per cu. foot. Dolomite should be added ONLY if the irrigation water supplies less than 25 PPM calcium and then only at a rate of 50 grams per cubic foot. Research has long shown that it is very detrimental to withhold nutrition during this most important developmental time in a tree's life. - Millet
     
  8. de bon chemin

    de bon chemin Member

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    unless you have a hybrid , this happen by outcrosspollination, the seeds of the F1 will not be true to the parent tree and it may get 2 or more stem ( with or without 2 sets of roots), by the Etrog:One seed is sprouting to one and only stem , No polyembryons in Etrogim, (but some albinos).
    Ronen: good job, you have now seedling with one set of "false" leaves, an other set should appear then the true leaves much larger and longer than this ones will come out .
    I didn't put any ferti' untill 5-6 inches high and a 6,3,3 is enough .I understand it may "burn" the fragile roots
    Oh and DO NOT WATER too much, let it dry out a little between watering.

    hatslach!!
     
  9. ronenzzz

    ronenzzz Member

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    Thanks !!!

    Well its been a while since my last post so i thought id give a run through.

    first i dont have the old networking equipment underneath them for heating anymore.

    I think they short circuited.

    I wonder why :-/

    Anyhoo i think they are doing good.

    Gave them some fertilizer in a really low concentration.

    Funny thing is i think they drink water like crazy. On the same tray where the etrogs are i have a couple of baby dates growing. Started from the seed. Madjool.

    anyhow i noticed that the date plant doesnt dry out at all while the etrogs dry out really fast.

    Ill try to post news pictures of all of them tommorow.

    Ronen
     
  10. de bon chemin

    de bon chemin Member

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    Taking time in this erratic life!!!
    Hi! Ronen,

    From which Etrog, did you used the seeds? -And if from Israel, from which orchard?
    I heard there are like 1st class etrog, and 2nd class, not only because grafting, but also due to the "used" ( its peddigree) of it.

    Great for the palm trees, funny the root starts from the "back" of the seed.

    Ronen, if you have time, check under thread: myrtus communis -Myrtle.
    Tell me if in Israel there is such a Myrtus (Hadassu-hadass-Etz'avot); as in the ritual of the holiday of the Tabernacle ( Autumn Equinoxe) "Succot" ( I think untill nowdays) the etrog, palm font, whorled myrtle, willow alba (babyloneen) are used.

    Here in USA, this year, not less than 4 persons contact me that they grow etrog trees: in Mexico, California, Arizona, NO not Florida yet ( there the special citrus squad uprooting them right away) they are afaid of cross contamination...I don't blame them.
    I wish all of you: Ale v'Hastlach ( success in your entreprise).
    have a nice day
     
  11. ronenzzz

    ronenzzz Member

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    Hey thanks for the post.

    Let me just say that these etrogs are from the type called the Hazon Ish type.

    Since the authenticity of the Etrog is so serious especially for religious puposes, there must be no mistake. Basicaly a long time ago the Hazon Ish (a leading Jewish halachic ruler) saw an etrog and claimed it to be a true and real etrog. The seeds of that etrog were planted and decades later are being used today.

    So I got the etrog , from which the seeds came from, from someone who was recommended by one of the Rabbis in my yeshiva. With the proper Kosher certificate and all.

    Basically no question that they are real and not grafted etc etc.

    Im still at work right now

    But i have taken more picture and will try to load them up when i get home.

    Also i'll look at that post you mentioned as well.

    By the way i have the other items as well.

    In hebrew they are called Hadasim, Aravot, and the palm you see :-)

    Bye for now
     
  12. ronenzzz

    ronenzzz Member

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    Hey people,

    Just got a few seconds so I'm uploading pics of the little etrog trees.

    By the way the etrog of which i got the seeds out of was so beautiful.

    Absolutely perfect. Shape, bumpinesss, no flaws.

    Also because of its origin.

    It costes 85 clams. By the way i was told there are some that go for 500 clams.

    good night for now.

    Ronen
     
  13. ronenzzz

    ronenzzz Member

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    Sorry pics didnt go up

    dont know why

    lets try again

    yep here they are
     

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  14. HAND2MAN

    HAND2MAN Member

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    I planted seeds from my etrog of Sukkot 2006 on tu b'shevat 2007! I have so far 26 seedlings. I tip-pinched 5 of the first ones and they are all dying. Of the remaing, several have leaves side by side and others have leaves in intervals. Anyone know why this may have occurred? Also, I re-potted them into peat pots and some are really thriving while others are dying.
     
  15. ronenzzz

    ronenzzz Member

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    What do you mean by tip-pinch?
     
  16. K Baron

    K Baron Well-Known Member

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    Hi

    The plants are too juvenile to be pinched, doing this, you are torturing them.

    Let them grow for at least 16 months....

    I am no expert but I have done the same.

    Good Luck!
     
  17. Liz

    Liz Well-Known Member 10 Years

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    For those of you wondering what Etrog is

    http://www.jewfaq.org/etrog.htm

    Fascinating stuff, Like the shape of the fruit. Does it get grown in Australia and is Etrog it's technical name or is that a religious term?
    Ta
    Liz
     
  18. HAND2MAN

    HAND2MAN Member

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    Tip-pinching is literally pinching out the center leaves so that the plant grows bushier rather than taller. I am afraid the reply from Karen is correct in that they were too young for that

    Can anyone then explain the variance in leaves (opposite vs. alternate pattern) from the same plant. Also, some are not making it at all while others are thriving. The ones that are doing quite well are beginning to lean over. Are they too young to use support like maybe a toothpick?
     
  19. de bon chemin

    de bon chemin Member

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    Yes, like 100 years ago, a russian Rabbi running away from the Tsarist Pogrom, brought with him a Citrus Medica " Diamante" from the Calabrian region of Diamante in Italy... and after using the fruit for the festival , planted it in his little fruits farm in Shaperton ( close to Melbourne).His name is R. Moshe ( Moses) Feiglin.

    The original tree is dead long ago but the grandchildren were propagating by softwood in the end of our summer ( that their winter - take in consideration, we are talking South Hemisphere).

    The funny part is that they won't use the fruits because they are to big and not so "clean" for the Sept-Oct Holiday season of the Tabernacles , but one of the great-great-grand children is proud to bring a few fruits from Sharpeton to Melbourne as a Mascot of the Family.

    The farm is sold ,the charm subsisted.

    I personnaly met the Cantors, Belfers and Feiglins descends of the famous Rabbi.

    Note: you can not ( and should not) bring any fruits, seeds, plants from outside to Australia ( and other lands as well), because the virus, nematodes and pests etc... are very prolific when not under control and when we catch them, the damages are unbelievable ( million of citrus trees had to be uprooted and burn in a few years in California, Florida, South of France: Menton, Riviera) And it's true for the doriphore (potatoes), mosaic and the wine rot (vineyards) .

    For tip-pinching: I heard that OK for lemon trees but for the etrog ( Citrus Medica) tree until it is rooted in its ground... don't disturb it, not cutting the tape root or/& pinching for forking the trunk (stem).(Eliezer Goldsmith from U. of Rechovot)

    I have a question
    - What's "girdling"( South African way ) ?
    How you do it, is it hard and "risky-dangerous", special technic and if you could explain the botanic principle involve.
    It is done not to kill the tree but (depending the season, before /after dormancy) to force blooming /delay flowers abscission.
    and what's "drought chock"? for the similar goal, how does it worked , how long etc.. if you could elaborate or/and send me a detail explanation (e.i. as link).

    Thank
     
  20. Liz

    Liz Well-Known Member 10 Years

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    Thankyou for that. Yes Shepparton is a big fruit growing area here in Vic. Not sure how much citrus as that tends to be further north at the boarder. Mildura.
    You are right Australia has VERY strict quarantine laws where plant and animal matter is concerned. If caught big problems. It includes not bringing in food stuffs including packaged. commercialy
    Liz
     
  21. de bon chemin

    de bon chemin Member

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    Hi! Ronen
    What's doing with the seedling, let see your growing Nachas ( cute),

    Thank you, to the one that send me "the Girdling" pdf file from the Yuma Mesa Agriculture Center Arizona University and the "Bark Invertion" message of the Citrus Grower Forum.

    Maybe soon about the whorled myrtus....

    Bye
     
  22. farmboy

    farmboy Member

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    congrats dude!
     
  23. ronenzzz

    ronenzzz Member

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    HELP !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    hey people, remeber those nice Etrog plants in the pictures above. Well i have moved 2 of them out into my backyard and now almost all of the leaves have turn silver or white.

    They have only been out for about a week.

    I will try to get a picture up tommorow but heres a better detailed explanation of what the leaves look like.

    First of all the top main leaf has been the slowest to get the symptom.

    its like the leaves are dried up and turn silver. I dont see any bugs or any bumps. the leaves just got paper thin and silvery or whitish.

    i dont see any marks or bites, nothing.

    ive looked up silver leaf. I only see that happening to cherry trees.

    But i dont think thats it.
    Also since there is a cherry tree within 2 meters of the etrog tree.

    I read something somewhere about plants that have been raised in darker conditions, just like mine, that when all of a sudden are put in full and strong light (dont forget Jerusalem is in the mountains and the sun is strong here), they go into shock or something and the leaves change colors.

    What do you guys think?

    IN the meantime i plan on waking up early in the morning and putting them in the shade.

    Then i plan on searching for my camera so i can post some pics.

    Wait - one other change. I replanted them into big pots and water well. I also placed a stick in each pot for them to be tied to for support.

    I dont think that could be a reason.

    But then again you guys are the experts.

    HELP!!!!
     
  24. Liz

    Liz Well-Known Member 10 Years

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    Maybe they were too soft and should have started in a protected shaded place and slowly moved to sun. Hopefully they will shoot new leaves. If I bring homeanything that has been locked up in a supermarket etc. I always give them time to harden in a safe place. This includes vegetable seedlings

    Liz
     

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