Seen yesterday at Glendoick gardens. Perthshire. Scotland. Tiny 4 petal flowers just like Euonymus...however leaves alternate. Celastraceae? Could be unusual/rare as the owners, the Cox family are 3 generations of plant hunters. Help appreciated. Thank you.
Ilex? Ilex vomitoria could be in the running, though it's from Eastern North America. There are over 570 species you can look through. Here's a photo that doesn't look totally wrong. Ilex vomitoria femflws4.jpg (640×480) (utexas.edu)
Thanks. Never considered holly! Would it not be huge? Ilex vomitoria....never seen it before. Garden is only open April and May. Would love to sneak a look in the autumn to see berries.
I thought that should be wrong, but it's what my reference photo showed. Maybe that was mis-identified. There is another south-eastern US native: Ilex decidua, which has perfect flowers, though the leaves don't look as rough as these. There are all those other 500 Ilex, though Ron B has said that the sheathed looking new shoot looks wrong for Ilex.
This might be completely off track but perhaps a Gymnosporia? In the Celastraceae family. The flowers are somewhat similar. Gymnosporia
Thank you for looking and your suggestion. However Gymnosporia flowers have 5 petals so can be ruled out. Mystery shrub has flowers with 4 petals. https://www.google.com/search?q=Gym...iw=1280&prmd=ivmnbtz&rlz=1C1CHBF_enGB785GB785
The Flora of Pakistan and The Flora of China both refer to 4-5 petals. Not something I have experience with though but thought it might have a possibility. florataxon.aspx
Thank you for help above. Back again today . Tiny berries now formed. Sorry, Pics not very good but capsules are not round, seem to be 4 part. I sent e mail to owner Ken Cox ...he has family planting records..still awaiting response.
It seems to resemble Cneorum (Rutaceae), though clearly different genus. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cneorum_pulverulentum https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cneorum_tricoccon
Thank you for your suggestion. Sorry for delay in replying. I was waiting in case experts could comment. I looked at Cneorum. Apparently only 2 recognised sp..neither seem to match Quote wiki...... Species[edit] As of January 2018, Plants of the World Online accepted the following two species:[1] Cneorum pulverulentum Vent. Cneorum tricoccon L https://www.inaturalist.org/observations?place_id=any&taxon_id=451772
MORE PICS. The gardens are officially closed, but as shrub was not fenced in I was able to sneak back a few times to take more pics. There seem to be 2 bushes side by side but only one had berries. One male one female maybe? The berries turned white and are in compartments rather than round. Yesterday there were hardly any berries left and a few had turned pink. I had to turn over a branch to get decent pics. No answer from Ken Cox...a very busy man running a busy garden centre. First 3 pics below taken on 8th June. Rest taken 30th July2024. Does this help at all? I am still looking.... https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/pharmacology-toxicology-and-pharmaceutical-science/celastraceae Quote from above.. 7.2 Order Celastrales Link (1829) 7.2.1 Family Celastraceae R. Brown (1814) The family Celastraceae consists of about 90 genera and 1000 species of trees, shrubs, or climbers. The stems are not uncommonly spiny. The leaves are simple, opposite or alternate, and stipulate. The flowers are small and actinomorphic and arranged in cymes. The calyx includes four to five sepals and the corolla includes four to five petals. A disc is present. The androecium includes three to five stamens. The gynoecium includes two to five-carpels forming a two to five-celled ovary, each locule sheltering a pair of ovules. The fruits are capsules, samaras, drupes, or berries. The seeds are not uncommonly arillate or winged. ...............................................................................................
Euonymus in Flora of China @ efloras.org says "Leaves opposite, rarely also alternate or whorled, ...". Maybe it's a rare one of the 130 or so species of Euonymus. "If it looks like a duck ...". You'd probably need a book.
Thanks. I made my last visit last week...22nd August 2024. Hardly any berries left. They started green, then went white, then blushed pink. Finally red. It had fresh flowers as well...see below I met the head gardener ..he didn't know what it was. He used his i phone with app....Ilex chinensis...but when I got home this didn't check out.
Yes, I've been using my favourite app on your photos, but the results have been unhelpful - Buddleja at 4% probability, Prunus, Salix, Daphne, Deutzia. The most sort-of likely it suggested at 2.5% probability was Laurus nobilis.
Good, thanks. I didn't think it was a laurel either, but I could see how it could come up with that, whereas the other suggestions didn't seem reflect well on that app at all (Pl@ntNet, which has given me some useful IDs in the past, was rated as one of the better ones).
This is driving me quietly nuts! Apps...Laurus nobilis!!!! OMG .... and people think they are accurate! Scary. Having said that they are getting better. But not in this case. I have now sent album of 31 pics to RHS Wisley. UK. https://www.flickr.com/photos/11713966@N02/albums/72177720319759077/ If you are a member they will id plants FOC from photos. I have suggested they get their 3rd year students on the case...would be jolly good practise. Something I forgot to mention is that the berries were under the branches not on top. I had to turn a branch over to take photos.
