Chip budding maples

Discussion in 'Maples' started by Bonnie123, Jan 21, 2005.

  1. Bonnie123

    Bonnie123 Member

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    Has anyone had any success with chip budding maples? I understand that it can be done and provides more material to work with, particularily with hard to find cultivars. I would be interested in anyones personal experiences with this. Thanks, Bonnie
     
  2. Dale B.

    Dale B. Active Member Maple Society 10 Years

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    I know that Heritage Seedlings uses chip budding for at least some of their Japanese Maple production.

    Dale
     
  3. Ralph Walton

    Ralph Walton Active Member 10 Years

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    OK, I'll bite. What's "chip budding"?
    Ralph
     
  4. Bonnie123

    Bonnie123 Member

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    chip budding

    Chip budding is when you graft a single bud to the rootstock. It apparently is supposed to be quite successful and it gives you more material to work with, rather than using a branch with three buds to graft, you can use all three buds for three different rootstocks, or you can graft the three buds in three different places on the one rootstock, giving you three times more luck at it taking. However, aside from a small bit of info on it in JD Vertrees maple book, there isnt very much information on it.
    Bonnie
     
  5. mr.shep

    mr.shep Well-Known Member 10 Years

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  6. Ralph Walton

    Ralph Walton Active Member 10 Years

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    Hi Jim: Thanks for that link. I'v seen a similar method (shorter top cut at a shallower angle) referred to as bud grafting.
    While we are on the topic of grafting, do you know of a source of info on green micro grafting? From what I've been able to gather so far it would be done at the stage of micro propagation where you would otherwise be taking the plantlet off the (liquid or gel) growth medium and planting into a soil mix for a period of incubator growing. Properly done it seems this method would take a whole year off the process to have a field or garden ready grafted plant.
    The proceedure I'm referring to is actually "micro" as in you do it under a stereo dissecting microscope.
    Ralph
     
  7. mjh1676

    mjh1676 Active Member Maple Society 10 Years

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    Bonnie:

    I think chip budding offers a way to maintaing or create a stock plant when rootstock or scion wood is at a premium. It is also possible to, or preferable to use this technique when one has a very vigorous understock to push the grafted buds, and the quality or health of the scion wood may be inquestion. One can also cut down the scion to two node increments and do a traditional graft.

    In any case, I would think you would want to eventually take and root a cutting or gaft a scion from your chip-budded cultivar to create a final specimen.

    It might also be applicable to graft buds from multiple cultivars onto the same rootstock to create a stock plant the held multipe cultivars. If you did not let any one cultivar overgrow the others,you could then cut from that stock for future plants.

    I would wonder if this method of propagation in maples would lead to an increased chance of mutation at the grafted bud then maybe creating a sport or effecting the characteristics of the cultivar. It is definately more labor intensive than grafting the entire scion which would likely be why it is not used more frequently--I am not sure of its overall success rate. It is very possible that you might lose more buds per graft than scions and the end success rate may be similar.

    In any case if you have only one or two scions, it couldn't hurt to hedge you bet if you couldn't cut down the wood you had.
     
  8. Bonnie123

    Bonnie123 Member

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    chip budding and zones...

    thanks for the link, I am curious about one thing and Im not sure how to do the 'conversion'...if its possible to start chip budding in zone 5 in April, how would that relate to a start time in zone 8. I cant figure out when I would be able to start.
     
  9. Bonnie123

    Bonnie123 Member

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    micrografting

    ...Do you have 'The Grafters Handbook'? The last two pages have a small bit of info on micrografting as well as a few information resources. If you dont I can try scanning it and email it to you.
    Bonnie
     
  10. Ralph Walton

    Ralph Walton Active Member 10 Years

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    Yes please

    I've sent you an email thru the forum so you will have my email address, and yes please on those pages and references.
    Thanks, Ralph
     
  11. Bonnie123

    Bonnie123 Member

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    chip budding

    ...in response to mjh1676...
    just so I get my information straight, do you mean that chip budding doesnt always make a perfect final specimen, but would enable you to grow that plant on for future material for grafting? I am just curious because I had heard that before and I wondered if thats what you were referring to.
    Thanks, Bonnie
     
  12. Ralph Walton

    Ralph Walton Active Member 10 Years

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  13. mr.shep

    mr.shep Well-Known Member 10 Years

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    Below is a link that may rather helpful to someone.

    http://www.ipps.org/International/Index.asp?RequestPage=Online/index.asp

    We did a lot of chip budding on Magnolias during the
    Summer months.

    Below is a link to the Magnolia Society and an article
    on chip budding.

    http://www.magnoliasociety.org/care_docs/chip_budding.html

    Ralph,

    Sometime get this book and get to know it. Mine was the
    4th edition that we used as our textbook. I think the one
    reviewer may be right in that the book does assume some
    prior knowledge of other areas of Plant Science related
    fields. Then again, for us, ours was a textbook for an
    upper division class.

    http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/t...3/103-9983387-4593429?_encoding=UTF8&v=glance

    http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/t...1/103-9983387-4593429?_encoding=UTF8&v=glance

    I have not looked at the Dirr book yet.

    http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/t...f=sr_1_5/103-9934073-8600643?v=glance&s=books

    Jim

    Sorry that not all of the links still work from the IPPS site.
    There are some rather valuable links that are working from
    that site however.

    Hi Ralph:

    Yes, I've heard of green grafting.

    I think so far in Biotechnology we have an idea of what
    we want to accomplish but what we are not asking is, at
    what expense? What problems can occur down the road
    and with tissue cultured Maples I want to see 20 and 30
    year old specimens before I can tell someone that tissue
    culture is a viable alternative to grafting or cutting growing
    our Maples. For the short term, tissue culture makes a lot
    of sense and the Biotechnological view of eliminating
    viruses is a good thing but are the plants more susceptible
    to fungal and bacterial diseases once they are grown
    outdoors for any real length of time? Certain plants have
    done well with tissue culture but from a nurseryman's
    standpoint I am not seeing a lot of one gallon plants
    become 15 gallon sized any faster than a grafted Maple
    will and in landscape settings I am not seeing Maples
    that have lived a very long life yet in comparison to a
    conventionally propagated Maple.

    I am not advocating you to go out and buy the books
    I referenced or purchase them from that particular source.
    Sometimes when we cite a name of the book, others may
    want to know how to get a copy, where to buy one and
    how much will it cost.
     
  14. mjh1676

    mjh1676 Active Member Maple Society 10 Years

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    Bonnie-

    You interpreted what I said correctly. I have not done chip budding myself or knowingly seen maples propagated in this fashion, but I would be concerned to see you proceed with the notion that it would be more successful than grafting or rooting.

    What I have gathered is that to push bud growth in maples the understock you would have to use for a high yield would be a "pusher" type seedling. It would be large and vigorous. I have sent very small sicons to collectors who use this type of stock to guarantee a higher success rate with the questionable wood. When you have to use shuch a large stock, the resulting budded maple will be greatly mismatched.

    I assumed that to look at this union, would not be visually appealing for many years if it was to catch up. I was also assuming that the extended incision need to remove and graft a bud would be more complex than a vertical cut to graft a scion, thereby greater chance for improper healing, infection and bud failure.

    MJH
     
  15. mr.shep

    mr.shep Well-Known Member 10 Years

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    Tissue culture: initial review & off-topic thoughts

    We have done some chip budding on Maples in the past,
    usually during late Spring (Western Garden Book zone 8
    designation) but we had our best results in early to mid
    Summer and just left the budded Maples right in a saran
    house with 50% shade.

    Ralph:

    I have a slanted view towards tissue culture Maples. I
    have met one of the more influential nurseries involved
    in tissue culture Maples at a nursery trade show back
    in the mid 80's and to take nothing away from their
    successes we felt that we needed to see long term
    results for tissue culture to make its mark in Maples.

    Our nursery received the original 6 varieties that were
    the first tissue culture Maples offered for sale. The
    varieties were Beni schichihenge, Beni kawa, Burgundy
    Lace, Crimson Queen, Ever Red and Red Trompenburg.
    The plants came to us in 4" pots to which we immediately
    popped them into one gallon containers and for the first
    year we grew them in the greenhouse. When we placed
    them in a saran house they started to falter the next season.
    We felt they had become susceptible to fungal diseases to
    which we could control that somewhat but we also learned
    those Maples did not like overhead water at all from
    sprinklers. About every 3 months we would examine the
    roots as we felt the root systems would make or break these
    plants for the short term. It took us a while to learn what
    we needed to do for them so they would produce a root
    system and all the while the plants just sat there in the can
    with little to no new growth. It took 3 years for these Maples
    to show any real growth and that did not happen until we
    had root development. By the 5th year they were small
    one gallon sized plants by our standards. There were losses
    in those first 5 years, roughly 1/3 of them died in the first
    two years for us.

    We concluded early on that although the process of producing
    these plants was novel that the practical application of these
    plants to survive in landscapes was almost nill until these
    plants developed a root system. We also saw the same kind
    of thing with the early Agapanthus, Raphiolepsis and Crape
    Myrtles that were tissue culture grown as well.

    For green grafting in Agriculture we have had marginal success
    in Fruit and Nut Trees. No real breakthroughs in Grapes and
    Citrus as of yet although there is a supposed protocol for Citrus
    understock. I think for ornamental shrubs and fleshy fruits
    such as Guavas (Pineapple, Lemon, Strawberry), Papayas and
    various dwarf Bananas that green grafting may have its better
    application. Yes, the grafting under a microscope can save
    us time but our major limitation will at first be to produce a root
    system just like the same problems we had in genetic engineering
    in non-edible plants almost 25 years ago. At least with the first
    engineered plants we incorporated into the plants a disease
    resistance mechanism of which today the trend is to keep viruses
    in check but we have plants that are more susceptible to fungal
    diseases more so than bacterial diseases at this point in time.
    Viruses is not our main concern in Japanese Maples as without
    a virus we have no variegation in our variegated forms. If you
    want a project to work on try to isolate and identify the virus,
    virtually the same virus that causes variegation in the flowers
    and in the leaves of Camellias also. We slit our own throats
    trying to eliminate viruses from a biotech point of view at least
    to those two plants and there are more of them as I can include
    variegated Conifers in the proverbial mix as well.

    http://www.practicalwinery.com/mayjune99/rapidpropagation.htm

    Jim
     
  16. Bonnie123

    Bonnie123 Member

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    Mjh

    Thanks, that does match up to what I've heard...gives me a bit to think about.
    Bonnie
     
  17. mendocinomaples

    mendocinomaples Active Member Maple Society 10 Years

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    Hi Bonnie,

    I have chip budded A. pseudoplatanus varieties in late July and August NW CA. With various degrees of success from year to year I gave up on this method to doing a more traditional winter side veneer grafting of this species, which gives me about a 85% take.

    I have tried it with other species but the amount of wood used in a chip bud is so small that it often will dry out or simply not take (it is also very cubersome on JM) .
    With larger rootstock on species such as A. psplt. it is a bit easier. The only reason I continue to use chip budding is so when I have so little scion available it will go a bit further.

    good luck,

    robert
     
  18. budoonk

    budoonk Member

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    hello bonnie
    I have t budded maples and it works fine.Ibudded a crimsom king maple on a noway maple. One side of the tree is red and the other green
     

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