Acer Seeds

Discussion in 'Maples' started by LoverOfMaples, Oct 3, 2019.

  1. LoverOfMaples

    LoverOfMaples Member

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    Hello everyone!

    I collected a few different types of acer seeds and was wondering if they all have the same stratification process to germinate as palmatum?

    I collected:
    Acer Campestre
    Acer Monspessulanum
    Acer Pseudosieboldianum
    Acer Pubinerve
    Acer Heldreichii
    Acer Shirasawanum var Tenuifolum
    Acer Tataricum
     
  2. emery

    emery Contributor Maple Society 10 Years

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    Well this is an easy answer: yes! :)

    The only thing is the first two may need to be double stratified (cold/warm/cold).

    Where did you get these? Not that easy to collect A. pubinerve (= A. wuyuanense) walking around town. BTW, the genus name is always capitalized, but not the species name. So should be, e.g. Acer campestre. FWIW!

    cheers, -E
     
  3. Margot

    Margot Well-Known Member

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    Do these maples come true from seed or do they cross pollinate with other compatible maples in the area? Just curious.
     
  4. LoverOfMaples

    LoverOfMaples Member

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    Im so glad to hear that. I visited the Arnold Arboretum and it open my eyes to so many different type of beautiful Acers.

    Thanks a lot for the info!
     
  5. emery

    emery Contributor Maple Society 10 Years

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    They mostly hybridize quite easily. The exceptions are the first two. At least I can't think of any monspessulanum hybrids off hand. I often get true seed from pseudosieboldianum, but of course the entire new "hardy range" (Jack Frost?) from Iseli are hybrids of pseudosieboldianum and palmatum.

    Come to think of it, can't think of any pubinerve hybrids either, but it's so rare that may be why. I only know one person who tried to grow these seeds, he was unsuccessful; but that's not to say they haven't grown any at the Morris in PA, where the best one I know of in the US grows. Interesting that the Arnold has now adopted the FOC naming, the name pubinerve isn't universally accepted (yet).

    Indeed the Arnold is amazing! I used to live in Boston, really loved the place. Another great place for maples there is the Mt Auburn Cemetery. if you're up in town and have time.

    -E
     
  6. LoverOfMaples

    LoverOfMaples Member

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    Im going to give pubinerve a shot and keep my fingers crossed that i can get one to germinate.

    I ran by iseli "jack forst" selection a little while ago. They create a good number of things over there. Next time im visiting east coast i will have to visit.

    By the way, Mt Auburn cemetery is definitely on my to go list this fall. I made a small list of places to visit this fall in early spring. Once i got to the Arnold i kicked myself for not visiting sooner and more often. Ill be going back in a few weeks and mid Nov for the color change. From the pic online of the cemetery i think ill be kicking myself again.

    Thanks again E for sharing such great information!
     
  7. Sulev

    Sulev Active Member

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    You inspired me to visit the Japanese garden in Tallinn Kadriorg Park, to find out if I can pick some Acer palmatum seeds, but unfortunately these 2 plants of that species, that I managed to find there, are still too young to bear fruits. Hence I'd like to ask, what age these maples are supposed to fruit? I did not manage to get an answer from Wikipedia and from quick search in the Internet, so I would be thankful, if someone can enlighten me in that matter.
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2019
  8. emery

    emery Contributor Maple Society 10 Years

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    There is no hard and fast answer. Some trees flower and fruit quite young, whereas others take many years. Exposition and water supply probably play a role. I don't know if any research has been done specifically relating to A. palmatum.

    It's not too late to sign up for the Maple Society seed distribution, you will get plenty of palmatum seed that way!
     
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  9. Sulev

    Sulev Active Member

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    Thanks for hinting to the Maple Society seed distribution scheme (I suppose that this is their website: Seed Distribution Scheme - 2019 | The Maple Society)! Unfortunately I am living in a very harsh climate for palmatums, so rather than selection by tree size, I'd prefer selection by the frost hardiness. I was hoping, that by picking some seeds from palmatums, that are already selected to be relatively tolerant in our climate (and actually managed to survive here), I will manage to decrease the risk of loosing all my seedlings.
     
  10. emery

    emery Contributor Maple Society 10 Years

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    Ah yes I see. Well you never know, hardiness is different for different seedlings. For example I grew Acer caudatifolium and started with perhaps 75 seedlings, of which perhaps 50 froze and died the first winter. But the survivors were only the hardiest, and in the end I have a group doing well in the ground, with many others given away or not proving hardy enough to survive.

    I see your point, but it may be the harsh conditions that are preventing these from seeding. You may want to try A. shirasawanum and A. pseudosieboldianum, which are hardier than A. palmatum. I sent the former into the seed distribution, but didn't have any of the later this year. If you PM me next fall I can send you some pseudosieboldianum if you want. Anyway you may need to grow quite a few seedlings to find some that are hardy in your zone...
     
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  11. Sulev

    Sulev Active Member

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    Actually I am not so competent to confidently identify Asian maples. I know, that there is large number of variations in each of these species, so maybe those "palmatums" are not palmatums at all. I remember, that when this Japanese garden was created (on 2011), then there were labels at most significant species, but yesterday there was no labels any more. I am not visiting this far corner of the park very often, so I can't tell, if these plants are still the same, that were planted more than 8 years ago or they are replaced already. I noticed, that these maples had leaf damages near the top, that could be caused by recent frosts. Took a photo (sorry, there is a "dark age" here, my phone can't do nice pictures at such a dim conditions) and attached to this message.
    I try to keep your kind offer in my mind! Thank you!
     

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  12. LoverOfMaples

    LoverOfMaples Member

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    Have anyone had Acer japonicum seeds to germinate the first year?
     
  13. AlainK

    AlainK Well-Known Member Forums Moderator Maple Society 10 Years

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    "Semences du Puy" recommends double stratification for both Acer japonicum and Acer shirasawanum :

    Soak the seeds in water for 72 hours, then warm stratif (20° C) for 120 days, followed by cold stratif (3-5° C) for another 120 days.
     
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  14. AlainK

    AlainK Well-Known Member Forums Moderator Maple Society 10 Years

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    ... but I have three Acer shirasawanum that I cold stratified like other maples, and three of them germinated the first year (the others never did).

    They're from A. shirasawanum 'Autumn Moon', but all three are different. One looks like the plain species, another one retains a few characteristics of 'Autumn Moon', but is far less spectacular, and the third one has leaves about half the size of the other two, like "var Tenuifolium".
     
  15. Sulev

    Sulev Active Member

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    From where did you get this information about different maples? I got some rare (in my country) maple seeds (like A. tegmentosum and A. monspessulanum, some others have no verified ID yet) this autumn, but my books lack of information, how to get these seeds to germinate.
     
  16. AlainK

    AlainK Well-Known Member Forums Moderator Maple Society 10 Years

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    As a bonsai enthusiast, I visit forums both in French and English, where people discuss cultivation techniques. Also there are lots of sources for maples in France, tree nurseries, associations, etc.

    For instance, the advice for stratifying seeds on the seed provider link that I posted can be easily translated through an online translation site.

    The page in French :
    ACER SHIRASAWANUM 2 g (Érable de Shirasawa)

    An online translation in Estonian :
    Google Traduction

    Most of the time, these online translations are awkward, but they can be useful. Since you speak English, double-checking with an English translation will help further :

    Google Traduction

    For instance, "rustic" is actually "hardy". So I suppose "Maalaisuus" is "hardiness" ;°)

    BTW, where in Estonia are you from ? I mean, I've never been but I guess the climate in the north-east can be quite different from the south-west coast.
     
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  17. Sulev

    Sulev Active Member

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    Merci beaucoup, Alain!
    I am very close to Tallinn, 59,3N. Almost as far to the North as British Columbia's northern border. I am ca 13 km away from the sea shore.
     
  18. AlainK

    AlainK Well-Known Member Forums Moderator Maple Society 10 Years

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    De rien, you're welcome, olete teretulnud - not sure of the translation in Estonian ;°)
     
  19. Sulev

    Sulev Active Member

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    Your suggested site is very good! I found at once that seeds of both those maples should be stratified very similar to the seeds of A. platanoides, our common maple. Maybe a little longer. I was afraid, that they may also need 240 days long stratification.
    "De rien" in Estonian is "tühiasi!" (l'un rien) or "pole tänu väärt!" :)
     
  20. AlainK

    AlainK Well-Known Member Forums Moderator Maple Society 10 Years

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  21. LoverOfMaples

    LoverOfMaples Member

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    This site is very helpful. I went on a seed collecting frenzy this year and have collect thousands of seed of different Acer species. Some name has been changed and E has corrected me on a few (maybe there is more to be corrected?). Hopefully i will have a good germination rate for most. Im also into bonsai and would love to have a crazy maple collection (bonsai and landscape trees). Ive collected so many because i want to try out a few fusion projects. Thanks so much AlainK. Im loving your bonsai maple btw.

    Acer buergerianum
    Acer buergerianum ssp. ningpoense
    Acer campestre var. leiocarpum
    Acer griseum
    Acer heldreichii
    Acer japonicum 'Aconitfolium' (Full Moon)
    Acer japonicum 'Aconitfolium' (Dancing Peacock)
    Acer micranthum
    Acer mono
    Acer monspessulanum
    Acer palmatum 'Burgundy Lace
    Acer palmatum 'Dissectum'
    Acer palmatum 'Oktoberfest'
    Acer palmatum 'Osakazuki'
    Acer palmatum 'Shigitatsu'
    Acer palmatum ssp. amoenum
    Acer palmatum ssp. palmatum
    Acer palmatum var. coreanum
    Acer platanoides 'Dissectum'
    Acer pubinerve
    Acer pseudosieboldianum
    Acer saccharum ssp. floridanum
    Acer shirasawanum 'Plamatifolium'
    Acer shirasawanum var. tenuifolium
    Acer tataricum ssp. ginnala
    Acer truncatum
    Acer tschonoskii ssp. tschonoskii

    I have a few more to add to the list.
     

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