Acer saccharum ssp. skutchii (aka Acer skutchii)

Discussion in 'Maple Photo Gallery' started by Gomero, Jan 8, 2010.

  1. Gomero

    Gomero Well-Known Member Maple Society 10 Years

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    This is a maple that grows in the cloud forests of Mexico and Guatemala.

    The genus Acer indeed occurs in Mexico with the species A. glabrum Torr. var. neomexicanum (Greene) Kearney & Peebles (Chihuahua), A. grandidentatum Nutt. (northern states of Chihuahua, Coahuila, Nuevo León, Sonora), A. grandidentatum Nutt. var. sinuosum (Rehd.) Little (Coahuila), A. negundo subsp. mexicanum (DC.) Wesm. (Coahuila, central and south Mexico), A. nigrum Michx. f. (Sonora). Only A. negundo subsp. mexicanum and A. saccharum subsp. skutchii occur in Guatemala.

    Acer Saccharum ssp. Skutchii grows to 15 m in its native range and, unusually for a maple, thrives in limestone soils. Samaras, up to 4.5 cm long, are regarded to be the largest in the genus. I have not been able to find info on hardiness. I took the pictures below at the end of January 2009 at S.F. Botanical Garden, so it takes well the weather of the Bay Area.

    Gomero
     

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  2. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

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    Re: Acer saccharum ssp. skutchii

    AA. grandidentatum and nigrum have also been placed within A. saccharum by some authors.
     
  3. Michael F

    Michael F Paragon of Plants Forums Moderator 10 Years

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    Re: Acer saccharum ssp. skutchii

    And Acer skutchii is also often (and probably better) treated as a distinct species.
     
  4. Daniel Mosquin

    Daniel Mosquin Paragon of Plants UBC Botanical Garden Forums Administrator Forums Moderator 10 Years

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    Re: Acer saccharum ssp. skutchii

    Photo of a plant, likely from the same seedlot (the signage was mounted on the tree for the individual I photographed).

    S.F. Botanical Garden, April 3, 2010
     

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  5. Lou midlothian Tx

    Lou midlothian Tx Member

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    Acer skutchii aka Mexican Sugar Maple

    I managed to grow one seedling. Viable seeds are hard to come by so it has a low germination rate but Stephen F Austin State University Arboretum apparently found a way to get higher germination by simply spreading 1 inch of composted pine bark fines on the ground beneath 2 mature trees and ended up with hundreds of babies this past spring. https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=...erFiles/File/PLANTS/Acer%20skutchii.pdf&pli=1 I am posting a picture that I took today. For some strange reason, it put on late growth and I thought it looked nice.
     

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    Soumil Yarlagadda likes this.
  6. chimera

    chimera Well-Known Member 10 Years

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    Re: Acer skutchii aka Mexican Sugar Maple

    Very interesting, congratulations on your success and thanks for sharing.
     
  7. Gomero

    Gomero Well-Known Member Maple Society 10 Years

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  8. Lou midlothian Tx

    Lou midlothian Tx Member

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    Re: Acer skutchii aka Mexican Sugar Maple

    Oh. I didn't know that. I just looked for "Acer skutchii" , not Acer saccharum ssp. skutchii so I thought I'd add a new one. Sorry about that.

    I see that they thrive in limestone soil and that's what I have. That's a great news for me! Thanks!
     
  9. maf

    maf Generous Contributor Maple Society 10 Years

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    Re: Acer saccharum ssp. skutchii aka Acer skutchii

    The two threads have been merged to keep all the pics and info together. Not sure which is considered the "correct" name; for now I have left a permanent redirect from Acer skutchii to this thread. Can always be reversed if Acer skutchii is a better fit.
     
  10. Gomero

    Gomero Well-Known Member Maple Society 10 Years

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    It is a bit like A. palmatum ssp. amoenum vs. A. amoenum, there is no universal agreement and it is not this forum that could change anything. While in the case of the Japanese maple I can point out to the Flora of Japan decision to state my preference for the second option (I believe that Japanese botanists know best their native trees), I cannot say the same for the A. saccharum ssp. skutchii vs. A. skutchii dilemma since Flora of North America has not yet treated the Sapindaceae and, thus, I do not know the position of North American botanists on the subject. However most of the sources I have found do tend to place skutchii as a ssp. of A. saccharum.

    Gomero
     
  11. alex66

    alex66 Rising Contributor Maple Society 10 Years

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    beautiful maple!remember me the question about leuocoderme,for some is saccharum spp. leuocoderme,for some is only acer leucoderme
     
  12. Lou midlothian Tx

    Lou midlothian Tx Member

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    Over here, it's often A. Acer grandidentatum for Bigtooth maple, Acer leucoderme for Chalk Maple, Acer barbatum for Southern Sugar Maple, etc. You get the idea. I'm just used to it but I know that some prefer A. saccharum (and other species) ssp. xxx. I guess it depends on who you run into. They all have their own preference of how it should be written.
     
  13. Michael F

    Michael F Paragon of Plants Forums Moderator 10 Years

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  14. maf

    maf Generous Contributor Maple Society 10 Years

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    Both names are listed in the alphabetical photo gallery, and both link to this thread; hopefully that will be enough for people to know where they are regardless of which is the acepted name in different regions.

    (Have to agree that lumping is not the best idea.)
     
  15. Gomero

    Gomero Well-Known Member Maple Society 10 Years

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    A lot of people have strong convictions one way or the other. The same data is sometimes used to justify one thing and its contrary. De Jong's classification is excellent, but it is his own interpretation and, as can be read in the different threads, some people question its correctness. We need more consensual approaches and, to me, Flora of XXXX seems to be a collective undertaking more conductive to consensus than individual lists (or have I misunderstood its operation?).

    Therefore, since I know nothing about Botany, when in doubt I consult the Flora-of-XXXX listing to learn the correct name. The problem is when the species in question has not yet been considered there, I'm stuck ;-)))

    Gomero
     
  16. NJACER

    NJACER Active Member Maple Society 10 Years

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    Dr David Creech the director of the Stephen F. Austin Gardens gave a presentation at the recent Maple Society meeting in Dallas TX. I was amazed at the number of maples that he is growing at the SFA Gardens and how well they perform. He was also kind enough to bring about 24 Acer skutchii or Acer saccharum ssp. Skutchii for the silent auction. Many of the Maple Society members will now have this in their collections.

    Ed
     
  17. Winterfell

    Winterfell Member

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    Nursery not far from me is offering this ssp. Variety, species, whatever you want to call it. I'll probably pick up one or two. I have a large big tooth maple on my property. Im assuming these will pollinate each other and produce some nice seedlings.
     
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