Acer palmatum 'Kawaii'

Discussion in 'Acer palmatum cultivars (photos)' started by yweride, Sep 15, 2005.

  1. yweride

    yweride Active Member 10 Years

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    This is a great plant, but hard to find. Photos taken 8/15/05
     

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  2. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

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    A mistake for Kauai, intentional misspelling, or another word entirely?
     
  3. yweride

    yweride Active Member 10 Years

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    Neither, it is spelled correctly. I have always wondered where it came from and who gave it such a name. Great plant.
     
  4. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

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    Well, then you really don't know if "Kawaii" is the original, correct spelling or not, right, if you don't know its history?
     
  5. mendocinomaples

    mendocinomaples Active Member Maple Society 10 Years

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    Kawaii is Japanese for cute. The plant is suppose to grow 2' X 2' in ten years.
     
  6. mapleman77

    mapleman77 Active Member

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    Can you post more pictures, please? David
     
  7. mapleman77

    mapleman77 Active Member

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    Recently found out from Eastfork that the originator is Talon Buccholz, and he named it that becuse, well, it's cute! She also said that he (Buccholz) said that it is a shirawasanum laceleaf, not a palmatum laceleaf, which makes me want it even more! I counted the lobes and it fits; on many of yweride's leaves, there were anywhere from 9-11 lobes, which is just something that is not found on a normal 'garnet' or other palmatum laceleaf.
     
  8. Gomero

    Gomero Well-Known Member Maple Society 10 Years

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    What is a 'shirawasanum laceleaf', never heard of that, a new subspecies?, do you know if a genetic test has validated the claim?
    It looks to me like a japonicum or a hybrid thereof;

    Gomero
     
  9. katsura

    katsura Active Member 10 Years

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    I notice in the picture on the left above that the samaras are carried with the
    wings pointing UP which is a characteristic of shirasawanum which gives further
    credence to mapleman's post #7 above. My 'Kawaii' is indeed a cute plant, stays
    reddish in full sun and is a very slow grower.
     
  10. Gomero

    Gomero Well-Known Member Maple Society 10 Years

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    Hi Katsura,
    Thanks for pointing out the samaras which I had not noticed. In addition I visisted the new Buchholz website and it is indeed proposed as a shirasawanum.

    However seeing its uniqueness among the other shirasawanum selections the question remains: is it a true shirasaswanum or a hybrid with shirasawanum being one of the parents?,
    can a shirasawanum hybridize with a japonicum?

    Gomero
     
  11. Kaitain4

    Kaitain4 Well-Known Member Maple Society 10 Years

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    That is indeed a good question. Which Acer species CAN inter-breed? I would really like to know this. Obviously Palmatum and Shirasawanum can...
     
  12. katsura

    katsura Active Member 10 Years

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    Good questions, Gomero & Kaitain.
     
  13. mapleman77

    mapleman77 Active Member

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    Well I think that these similar species can interbreed, because where else could 'Johin' and 'Sensu' and the like come from? I think that similar species (aka the "japanese maple" clan--palmatum, japonicum, and shirasawanum) can and do interbreed, just as other species of animals can. I also find it interesting that it can be grafted on palmatum rootstock, even though it is a "full" shirasawanum or a hybrid. Or, it's grafted on shirasawanum rootstock.
     
  14. Kaitain4

    Kaitain4 Well-Known Member Maple Society 10 Years

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    Not sure its as straight forward as all that. There are something like 23 native JM species. There are also native species in the US that are closely related to JMs. So what is the complete list of inter-breeding capability?

    i.e. :
    A. palmatum x A. shirasawanum = TRUE
    A. shirasawanum x A. japonicum = ??
    A. palmatum x A. saccharum = FALSE
    A. japonicum x A. circinatum = ??

    etc. etc.
     
  15. mapleman77

    mapleman77 Active Member

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    K4,

    I have to disagree with you in that A. saccharum is a "japanese maple." Is it not the botanical name of a sugar maple? When I say "Japanese maple," I mean the various maples that are native to china, korea, and japan, and maybe a few others. I think that A. circinatum and A. campestre are about as far as I would go to call a japanese maple. I also think that the only reason that these "japanese maples" (shirasawanum, palmatum, and japonicum) breed successfully is because they are much more genetically similar to each other than other acers. Shirasawanum and japonicum used to be considered the same, you know. :)

    Well in any case I think that this should be talked about on another thread. Very interesting stuff and I really want to get to the bottom of this but the title of this thread is 'Kawaii' and I would like more information about this cultivar, whatever species it may be. LOL

    David
     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2008
  16. Kaitain4

    Kaitain4 Well-Known Member Maple Society 10 Years

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    Yes, I realize A. Saccharum is an American species. That was just a 'for instance'. I want a list of Japanese species compatability (including Korean & Chinese I suppose) and Japanese/American species compatability. There should be a few species here that are close enough to cross-breed.

    This does belong on another thread!
     
  17. Daniel Mosquin

    Daniel Mosquin Paragon of Plants UBC Botanical Garden Forums Administrator Forums Moderator 10 Years

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    New thread where the conversation re: hybridization is continued.
     
  18. mr.shep

    mr.shep Well-Known Member 10 Years

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    There is a 'Dissectum' cultivar of Japonicum
    and some of you may have another cultivar
    known as 'Green Cascade'. There is a third
    dissectum Japonicum cultivar around that
    came about as a selected seedling but few
    people have ever had it in their collections.

    The 'Kawaii' was purported by some people
    to have originally come from Japan and is
    a dwarf form dissectum. Even the RHS
    recognizes 'Kawaii' as being - Acer palmatum var. dissectum 'Kawaii'.

    Mr. Yano and his consortium in Japan seems
    to consider 'Kawaii' a palmatum as well (although
    from the Ganshukutei web site it seems to
    them may be a palmatum, not a matsumurae.

    Maples I~L

    Below is another link telling of the slow growing
    ability of this tree. One meter in height in ten years
    (in the ground) is being pretty generous from what
    I've seen however.

    Acers from Junker's Nursery (8)

    Jim
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2008
  19. mapleman77

    mapleman77 Active Member

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    Well in the bloomriver Gardens website, they list it as a palmatum dissectum as well. But if Talon Buchholz is the originator, I would have to trust him more than anyone else, seeing as he introduced the cultivar. Eastfork nursery is selling one on Ebay and you can find more information there.

    David
     
  20. Poetry to Burn

    Poetry to Burn Active Member

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    The plant on ebay is going for mad money. The hype seems ridiculous on this cultivar.
     
  21. mapleman77

    mapleman77 Active Member

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    Yes, that's true! I would never pay that much for a 1 gallon cultivar--no matter HOW rare it is. I will find a better price for it. But if those people want to pay that much, let them! But to those lucky few who actually have this cultivar, can you post some more pictures, like of spring and fall coloring?

    David
     
  22. mapleman77

    mapleman77 Active Member

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    Katsura,

    where did you get your Kawaii? You seem to have had it long enough to see it's uniqueness among the japanese maple realm.

    David
     
  23. TrentCoole

    TrentCoole Member

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    Wow, that is an amazing plant. I always knew of the intricate leaf patterns of maples but this is out there. Even the seed casings are striking. Iintriguing discussion folks. You get to the heart of the subject don't you?
     
  24. katsura

    katsura Active Member 10 Years

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    David,
    I got my 'Kawai" from Eastwoods Nurseries in Washington, VA 22747
    telephone 540-675-1234.
    It has grown VERY slowly but even in mid afternoon sun it has not
    burned and kept its loveliness.
    Good luck & have fun.
    Mike aka 'katsura'
     
  25. pensylvaticum

    pensylvaticum Active Member

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    From my understanding it is not palmatum, not a japonicum but shirasawanum?Quite a few cultivar placed in japonicum are now classified as shirasawanum!!!!It may be a hybrid, but classified as the latter, and is not related to circinatum the only North American native maple related to A.palmatum, A japonicum etc.
    Thanks.
    P
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2008

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