Identification: Acer (?) id

Discussion in 'Maples' started by medgardener333, Jan 14, 2020.

  1. medgardener333

    medgardener333 New Member

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    Good evening,

    I've been told this is a dwarf Acer plant. Is it so, and does anyone happen to know which particular variety it is? Bought in Macedonia, Greece. Leaves went a bit more red before falling in autumn. Pics are from summer. I notice that toward the end of summer the leaves seem a bit greener. Many thanks for your suggestions.
     

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  2. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

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    It can be seen that it is a Japanese maple (Acer palmatum) but there are hundreds of named forms of those. Also what is the nature of the source, are they a serious commercial operation where they are likely to have sold you a grafted specimen of a named cultivar? (And if so, have you now lost the cultivar name?) Or instead somebody that supplied a spontaneous seedling that popped up, told you it would have a dwarf habit without any actual specific basis for that assurance?
     
  3. medgardener333

    medgardener333 New Member

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    Thank you. It is the latter. I think acers are not so commonly sold here, and there were two specimens only in that store. I was told that this is a dwarf. It seems to me most sales assistants in plant nurseries here are not necessarily experts, even when it comes to varieties of more native plants. I don't mind not knowing the exact cultivar name, but I wanted to check whether it is an acer to begin with. Thank you for your kind message.
     
  4. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

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    So far it does not look to have the congested manner of growth and small leaves often produced by many dwarf Japanese maple selections. And if it is a seed raised specimen dwarfness would not be expected, unless it happened to be a dwarf genetic variant.
     
  5. tiko7

    tiko7 Active Member

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    If it is from Greece, then it might be rooted cutting of "atrpopurpureum". They are imported from there in the neibourhing countries by the thousands and are sold very cheap.
     
  6. emery

    emery Contributor Maple Society 10 Years

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  7. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

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    Wrong leaf shape for Atropurpureum in a horticultural sense, otherwise could be considered an example of f. atropurpureum if one considers that botanical designation to apply to any and all purple leaved Japanese maples regardless of what other characters each has.
     
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  8. emery

    emery Contributor Maple Society 10 Years

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    That's pretty much exactly how the cultivar group key places it. "Contains all the upright growing cultivars with red foliage, with the excepting those belonging to the Linearilobum Group or the Witches Broom Group". We could argue about whether we like the groupings, but it is what it is. Yes the leaves look like matsumurae form.
     
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  9. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

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    Another thing about the leaves: it lacks the percentage of rounded off center lobes typical of Japanese maples derived from brooms.
     
  10. tiko7

    tiko7 Active Member

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    That is what I meant- any unknown maple with red leaves is named Atropurpureum, though there is a certain cultivar "Atropurpureum"
     
  11. medgardener333

    medgardener333 New Member

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    Thank you all for your very useful messages, I'm learning a lot while digesting all the essential jargon. I will try to extract mote information from the sellers, although I'm not sure I'll be successful. Size could be an issue. If it weren't a dwarf, as the consensus seems to be, would it be possible to check its size without torturing the tree? Any info about its root system (it is a small garden) and, worst case scenario, would a transplant be possible if done carefully?
    Tiko7, I read about a maple variety native to Northern Greece, is this what you are referring to? The price wasn't particularly high, about 15 euro if I remember well. It'd be nice if it turned out to be a native plant I could field research. Any information about its geographical expansion (North? Epirus? Macedonia?).
     
  12. tiko7

    tiko7 Active Member

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    Acer palmatum is native to Japan,Korea, parts of China and Russia. I meant that in Greece there are producer of cheap rooted cuttings of this variety. Or importers. You can transplant it without worries when dormant( without leaves?) It has shallow root system and can be pruned to maitain size with no problems. You can also grow it in a pot with adequate substrate and keep it in partial shade from 11am to 14pm - ideal for most acers.
     
  13. medgardener333

    medgardener333 New Member

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    Thank you again. I also meant to post this photo showing a shoot growing sideways from very close to base - it seems to be longer than the trunk. This may not be so clear in other pics. Can it be trimmed or is it too early for that?
     

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  14. emery

    emery Contributor Maple Society 10 Years

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    For a few maples that are native to Greece (or will do well there) you could look at the Maple Society Open Science Initiative article by Piotr Banaszczak of Rogów Arboretum, on maples of Southern Europe: https://maplesociety.org/sites/default/files/Banaszczak-MaplesOfEUpartII.pdf.

    Personally I would choose a tree that fits the spot, rather than try and prune the top. I would guess that left to its own devices your maple will reach 5-6m in height, 3-4 in width… As mentioned the root system is not problematic, and it is suitable for a pot, which will also keep it smaller and allow for root pruning which will constrain the size.
     
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  15. medgardener333

    medgardener333 New Member

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    Thank you very much for the link and the advice Emery.
     

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