I dug a huge Ceanothus (8'x9') at a request from a customer. Great root, crammed it into my van intact. Then noticed a struggling Acer 6' away from where the Ceanothus was, in the same bed. Acer has signs of Verticillium wilt ie. cambium loss and root damage at the root collar and up about 6". Removed Maple, carefully , all debris in plastic etc. Sterilized all tools. Do I have to dispose of Ceanothus? I took it home feeling very guilty. It is so beautiful. Potted it into a 36" pot, carefully monitering root soil. Still feeling very guilty. The Ceanothus has three stems 2-3" caliper and a crown to make you sing. I have many large and small Maples, large Catalpa, and a zillion other plants. I have to cut it up and take it to the dump don't I? Fran
The Verticillium in the Maple cannot be transmitted to the Ceanothus through air, from shared soil or due the roots touching each other. The quick decline form of Verticillium comes from dirty (already contaminated rootstock) and then when the scion is grafted onto the rootstock the Verticillium is allowed to spread throughout the plant. Your Ceanothus will not perish because it came into contact with the Maple. Yes, you should keep the Ceanothus. Jim
It will, however, probably perish from being dug up. Time will tell, if it does not wilt and shrivel then your thinking that the big, intact ball was a coup will be proven right.
Mr. Shep thanks for responding. I am not worried about the Ceanothus experiencing decline. { I was planning ( if I keep it) to give it " Mykes" to assist its health.} I am worrying about the Verticillium in the soil that may be attached to the fibrous roots of the Ceanothus ; and that soil leeching through the pot to any garden space that is sits in; and if I do plant it, to any garden that I plant it in, thus contaminating and infecting adjacent plants to it. I have read in my research of it that the disease stays as a mycelia or microsclerotia in the soil for up to many years. What I don't know is are the mycelia etc. in the soil anyway, and randomly infest stressed (many reasons) plants? I do not want to spread such a beast around. Thanks Fran
Ron is right, large older Ceanothus do not like being transplanted. I know that firsthand but if we are careful and mindful of what we are doing, we can manage. There is a huge discrepancy with Verticillium in the soil and Verticillium in a Maple. Ceanothus die here more so due to water mold fungus diseases from us watering them too much and too often. We do not treat them as being a drought tolerant plant and we lose many of them because of it. Even if the Maple was not a grafted plant, the slow decline form of Verticillium is already in the plant unless the plant was germinated from seed. It is the quick decline form that will attack from the roots and plug up the vascular system rather fast. We call it quick decline due to once we see the symptoms of it the plant will wilt and die on us relatively quick. The slow decline form can take upwards of three to five years or more of a slow dieback from the top down. What happens is that the branches die back starting from the tips and will proceed a ways and then either stop or kill the entire branch. I've seen one large branch succumb to the slow decline form and yet the other branches were unaffected for years to come. The slow decline form is triggered by stress to the plant in some way. The slow death result is that we lose more wood than the plant will regenerate from new growth. This goes on over time until the plant gives up. How large or how old was the Maple that had the effects of a disease? I cannot see the tree to know if these were indeed symptoms of Verticillium as it could very well be another disease that affected the Maple. Even when Maples show signs of the slow decline form of Verticillium the pathogen is not in the soil. Maples on their own roots can still live in a soil that has the soil borne Verticillium in them. The misconception is that the quick decline form from the soil borne organism kills older Maples. This is generally not true. It takes another disease to weaken the plant and then the slow decline form of Verticillium may eventually kill the plant. It is the quick decline form that kills young, mainly grafted Maples usually about 2-5 years old sometimes a little older but not a whole lot older. You are feeling the Maple was growing in a soil that has Vertcillium in it and I am not so sure of that at all. After all the Ceanothus seems to be unaffected and if the soil had the quick decline form of Verticillium in it, the Ceanothus would not be alive today. The Ceanothus is your proof Verticillium is not in the soil. I bet the Maple has Tight Bark or a form of Pseudonomas instead. Jim
Thanks to Ron and thanks to Mr. Shep both for the " heads up" about the larger Ceanothus not liking transplanting. I've not moved them this large before. I am having a Maple sample from the distressed tree tested in an arbourist lab. I will not feel so nervous about keeping the large C. around for the time before results. The sick Maple was planted about 6 years ago from a 5 gal. plant most likely grafted. It was well for a couple of years seemingly, then just did not really thrive. No noticeable top death. Buds all ready for spring, but the roots were mush on one side, my trowel went through them while I was excavating to expose the root collar buried 2" below wet ground ( bad one). And the bark was dried on about a third of the stem of the tree at the first 5" of trunk (-ground up) covering dead cambium in these areas. The tree was only about 6 ' tall, and caliper perhaps 1-1.5 inches. Thanks for all the information on Verticillium. I have been reading everything I can find on it = more questions. Fran
Last word on this issue and thread as I do not trust arbortist labs at all. They are not trained in pathology. Verticillium in the plant and how it got there is the the most misunderstood diseases of Maples. By your description it will not matter to me what the arborist lab comes up with as Verticillium can be found in the plant but the symptoms as described that are showing is another pathogen entirely. The problem there is for a lab to find that pathogen we may have you give them a hint as to what it is, otherwise they may not find it. We've been through that before when we had Maples that came into us from another state and Maples from another country tested. If you want to know which form of Verticillium is in the soil then you have to test for the presence of it being there, not in the plant. A lab test for Verticillium can conclude being positive but what is not told is which form of Verticillium and we need to know that as their killing actions over time are not the same. One form we can live with up to a point and the other form is a swift and assured quick death to a plant. It is the latter form that congers up the horror stories. Next time I suggest you take your soil and tree to a government lab and ask them to test for Verticillium in the soil and test for the presence of Pseudonomas in the plant. Jim
If all else fails, perhaps take a dozen or more cuttings and a dose of patience. I have had success propagating Ceanothus v. in this manner. Good Luck!
My opinion, do you really even want the possibility of adding an incurable disease to your yard? I know I have some kind of soil born disease in my soil that will kill some random plant every once in a while. I probably got it by bringing home one of the sick plants I can get for free sometimes. If I had it to do over I would have been a lot more careful about what I brought into the garden. It's very sad to watch a prized plant die and know there is nothing you can do about it. Also I agree about the Ceanothus, they do not transplant easily.
