Oregon grape and Deer

Discussion in 'HortForum' started by Ilyan, Jun 20, 2010.

  1. Ilyan

    Ilyan Member

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    Location:
    Carmarthen, Wales
    I have a forest a mile from the National Botanic Garden of Wales. They have a deer fence right around it so they are not thinking about my problem with Deer. The venison from my forest is very expensive having fattened on the buds they eat off my Walnut transplants. They also damage Cherries and regenerating Douglas Firs.

    If I plant Mahonia Aquifolium (Oregon Grape) might it protect my trees? I am trying some next to some small Walnuts, hoping that the Waluts are protected and able to survive until big enough and then produce toxin to kill their neighbour. I have put some next to Douglas fir with more confidence as I read they are understory in natural Douglas forests and I aim for a continuous cover system. Continuous cover suggests a need for expensive careful individual extraction, so I aim for very high quality timber. I plant Chamaecyparis Obtusa betting on a hotter climate and hope to have C. Nootkatensis in case it gets colder. Had difficulty getting seed for Nootka - then one gram cost as much as an ounce of Obtusa.

    People in British Columbia might be experienced with that Mahonia and perhaps have some advice. I will be thankful for any. I have been warned that Douglas emerging from Brambles can suffer severe wind damage.

    I will copy this to my Welsh Botanic neighbour.
     
  2. Ron B

    Ron B Paragon of Plants 10 Years

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    I have never seen any damage to Mahonia aquifolium but since you have a different deer species local experience might not apply. The deer here don't go for Ilex aquifolium either.

    Putting wire around the trees while they are small enough to be interfered with would probably produce the most satisfactory outcome.
     
  3. Ilyan

    Ilyan Member

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    Thanks Ron,
    My original idea was to plant Walnuts along the extraction tracks to suppress Blackberries, unfortunately that is a good way to introduce Deer to the delights if eating Walnut buds. Also some transplants (cell grown) were pulled clean out of the ground.

    Last winter I started used two litre plastic bottles with the bottoms cut off as protection for the buds, threaded on a stick so they sit over the top of the transplant, and using a strong secateur, cut through the thick part of the neck of the bottle in case it gets forgotten and has to be cut off a tree. I leave them on until leaves are apparent inside the bottle. (we get late frosts) Then there is a storage or a littering problem which has started me thinking about doing it naturally with Mahonia.

    We have Fallow Deer, and expect Muntjack to arrive shortly. Farmers in the UK can get Govt. Grants for planting trees in their fields, So I am thinking of food sources in the forest. Hope that Deer will not eat Monkey puzzle trees (Araucaria) because those trees are much more expensive. As you have to have two sexes to get the kernels, research is needed on gender detection or reproduction by cuttings from female plants.

    It maybe that an electic fence wire would deter deer feeding off the track.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2010
  4. Fen Sandar

    Fen Sandar Active Member

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    Location:
    Peoria, IL USA
    Electric is good! also just plain fences far enough from the tree that the deer cannot reach over them to eat your plants works.

    Deer do not like the smell of predators and they do not like startling noises. If you have empty cans or plastic bags, try stringing them where the deer will brush up against them if they go for your trees, or you can go to your local hunting supplies store and see if they have any large cat spray stuff for deterring deer. They do not like areas that has been scent marked by predators (of course you would have to apply pretty much every time it rained...cans and plastic bags are easier!).

    Get creative...windchimes or other things - anything that makes noise! Maybe even motion detecting sprinklers :]
     
  5. Ilyan

    Ilyan Member

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    That is a broad grin Fen, but there are miles of track it was intended to Walnut plant. The smell of predators sounds good. We did have some evicted tree protestors who had a dog acting as forest guardians, but they found houses and jobs, so there is no resident dog. The supply of displaced EF! tree protestors has rather dried up.
     
  6. Michael F

    Michael F Paragon of Plants Forums Moderator 10 Years

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    "Speciality walnut-fed venison" could probably command a premium price at the local farmer's market . . .
     
  7. Fen Sandar

    Fen Sandar Active Member

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    If ya have soup, beer, or carbonated beverage cans made out of metal and cheap coarse string then that is probably your best bet.
    The predator spray stuff has to be reapplied after it rains heavily and/or wears off (i think about a week? I haven't used in about 7 years so there may be higher quality now.) so you will be constantly stocking up if ya go with that. Probably a temporary fix at best.

    I did find this link maybe your area has something similar but cheaper? Three months with no washouts sounds pretty good...but you have a lot of space to cover so I don't know if there is enough in these containers for your purposes. If you go with this specific one, I would buy a little to start with and treat some selected areas to experiment, then if it works invest in the largest amount you can afford. Buying in bulk is usually cheaper per amount than buying a bunch of little containers (unless you can get a bulk deal on the little containers).

    Also this link is worth looking at although I have found mixed results on the fifth one.
     
  8. CHARIJI

    CHARIJI Member

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    I have a multitude of Oregon Grape plants here on the Sunshine Coast (Sechelt Peninsula) in British Columbia, Canada. The deer love them!! and almost everything else on the acre property! So a deterrent they are not.
     
  9. Ilyan

    Ilyan Member

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    Location:
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    Thanks for all the contributions
    One local adviser has suggested wrapping wool from sheeps fleeces around the transplants might deter the deer from eating leaves and buds. whether it is a deterrent smell or discomfort through wool strands in the teeth was not suggested. Tomorrow I collect some free fleeces as it seems the price of wool does not cover the cost of shearing for small lots and they are not worth collecting commercially in any case.

    Another advisor says that deer prefer cattle grazed land to sheep grazed land. But perhaps that has to do with closeness of biting - I was told a sheep can starve a cow, but a horse can starve a sheep. I used to cycle their grazing as a control on parasite build up. Cow -sheep-horse -rest for regrow. Sheep grazing in winter keep fields clear of ragwort in the UK.

    The Walnuts not attacked by deer are two or three times bigger now, and quite a few of the attacked died. Oregon Grape is not growing fast enough to protect Walnuts. I must go see how well it is doing under the Douglas. -After setting up the sheep fleece for Walnut protection experiment. Urgent as I suspect Fauns of eating the leaves that came from he buds their parents did not eat in the winter.
     
  10. Tree Nut

    Tree Nut Active Member

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    When my trees were young I protected them with stucco wire. I wrapped around the trees with stucco wire about 3 feet in diameter and it protected them nicely. It provides a barrier about 4 feet high. In most places it comes in 50 or 100 foot rolls.

    Once the tree is tall enough it can be removed and re-used. It protected all my trees and I have very hungry deer all around me.
     

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