hello, I've got my lemon tree for about 2 months now and I have to admit I've done many wrong things.. At the beginning I put it too close to radiator and over watered and so after about first 2 weeks my tree started to drop leaves. I think it's the radiator's fault because mainly dropped those leaves which were closest to the radiator. From then I learned from my mistakes, i kept my tree farther from radiator and watered it only when the top layer of soil was dry and leaf drop stopped. But now the problems have started again. When i bought the tree it had 2 or 3 leaves which looked not very healthy and had some kind of light-brown spots on them but recently many leaves have deformed and many have those light-brown spots and the tree is dropping a leaf from time to time (in last 3 days 4 leaves have dropped). And I've spotted something like web-leads on some of the leaves (as you can see in pictures) so i'm thinking it might be spider mite. Though I haven't spotted any spiders. If it really is spider mite what should I do? And if it's not
krx, I'm having a hard time seeing the fine detail on your photos. When I downloaded them and blew them up they pixelated so I can't tell if you have spider mites. The definitive test for spider mites is to hold a white sheet of paper under the leaves and stems and tap. Look carefully for tiny 8 leg creatures moving around. You may need a magnifying glass. If it is red spider mite they will be bright red dots. The other thing that I noticed but could not see well enough were tiny white spots on the under sides of the leaves. You could also have mealy bugs or scale crawlers. It is possible to bring home an infested plant without realizing it. To be on the safe side I would treat it with horticultural oil. Be sure to use the light oil and not dormant oil (too heavy). That will take care of any of the three problems. There are lots of posts on all these pests so try the search function. You have a nice looking tree. Good luck.
thank you, sabagal. I did as you said and really - some kind of creatures fell down on my paper. I have pretty weak magnifying glass so I can't tell whether they have 8 legs or not, but they are definitely moving around. When I buy this horticultural oil (gonna do it tomorrow), how often and for how long do I have to spray it? Do I have to do anything else or that's it? For example, HERE the owner is suggested to "remove at least the top two inches of soil in case they have laid eggs".
It is possible you knocked scale crawlers off if you don't see 8 legs. They will also move very quickly. When you buy the oil follow mixing directions and spray your tree until it is totally saturated. Be sure to get into every crack and crevice and the undersides of all the leaves. The eggs and newly hatched crawlers like to hide in the smallest place they can find. By the size of what you are dealing with, one treatment should be all you need. The oil will suffocate any pests without harming your tree. Then all you have to do is keep a close watch to prevent any future infestations. I don't know about removing the top 2" of soil. That may help with spider mites but scale and mealy bugs lay their eggs on the plant. Maybe Millet, Junglekeeper or Skeeterbug will know. My studies did not include much on spider mite reproduction. I specialized in predators (neat critters). Let us know how the tree does.
When webbing is mentioned the first thing I think of is spider mites. It seems to be confirmed since you detect moving specks on the paper. I've had success treating spider mite infestations using insecticidal soap and without having to remove any soil. However I do take the precaution to spray the top of the soil to catch wayward mites. Also, the treatment is ineffective against the eggs and so must be repeated in order to kill newly hatched mites.
hello again, I haven't got many garden centers in my area, yesterday I went to one of them but unfortunately they didn't had that horticultural oil and I didn't had time to visit another one. As I had read in this lovely forum that soap will do just as fine as oil, yesterday evening I mixed up that 1% soap solution and sprayed my tree from top to the bottom with it. Today I did that that "paper sheet test" again and just one spider fell off though it wasn't moving so I think it was quite dead. Guess that spider mite problem has been halfway conquered. Gonna spray my tree again this evening in case some lucky spider has survived. There are two things that makes me worry now. What to do with damaged leaves? Some of them, as you can see in 5th picture (in 1st post), are damaged really badly. And my tiny lemon has suffered too, as you can see in picture #3. This damage is from the spider mites, isn't it? Second thing is about blooming. When I bought my tree it was late autumn/early winter. During first three weeks the tree was blooming really nice, it had about 8-10 blooms but since then there hasn't been not even one bloom. It's winter now and weather during last month has been really cloudy with almost no direct sunshine. Is it because the tree is rather inactive because of lack of sunshine? I haven't fertilized my tree yet.
Citrus trees bloom in response to stress---usually that is cold stress in the form of about 800 hrs of temperatures below mid 60s (20 C). The primary bloom period for most citrus is early spring, although some are almost everblooming. Citrus do not grow much during winter unless they are kept at warm temperatures (above mid 60s--including roots), and when they do grow they grow in spurts called flushes, then the top stops while the roots grow. Since your tree is not actively growing right now, it does not need much fertilizer, but you should fertilize your tree regularly with a fertilizer containing trace minerals as close to 5-1-3 NPK ratio as you can find. I prefer slow release--it last several months and most of them are temperature dependent (they release faster in summer--slower in winter). Skeet
You might save yourself some trouble by waiting before spraying again, particularly if you were thorough the first time. You'll catch the stragglers and newly hatched by repeating the treatment several times with a period of 7-10 days in between each one.
Well, ok, thank you. And what about those damaged leaves and my little lemon? Will they drop because of the damage? Maybe I should remove my little damaged lemon or maybe it will get well?
The damage is done and is permanent. The leaves don't look that bad and they still function. I wouldn't worry about them. As for the fruit whether to remove it or not is a matter of aesthetics.
Are you sure you even have a Spider Mite problem. Generally speaking a few Mites are not going to do any visual damage at all. It takes a fairly large population of Mites to start showing damage. At this point you would see yellow speckling on leaves and webbing at the nodes or branch joints. Should easily be visual by eye just looking at the undersides of the leaves. A couple damp rags and quick rub each week will help control Mites on that little plant much faster then spraying and waiting if you ask me. Not too sure what the white is on the top side of the leaves, if it is dust or some residual from something. Plenty of light and making sure the roots get a chance to dry out once in a while will help too. And that 5th picture is not Spider Mite damage. Looks more like soggy root damage, or in that vicinity anyway. That's my 2 cents. Jim S.
jimweed, thanks for your comment. My leaves doesn't have yellow speckling and there are no webs either and undersides of leaves look pretty clean. No leaves had fallen in last 4 days but today I came home and found 2 leaves on the ground. And now you're saying my tree might have a root problem. You mean root rot? I haven't watered my tree for about a week now because the top of the soil is still moist. About that white on the top of the leaves - I've been spraying water on leaves once or twice a day and I guess that white is something from the water (now i've wiped it off). It's not harmful to do that, is it?
Washing down a citrus tree generally will do little to no harm, and often can be beneficial. However, it really all depends of the soluble salt concentration of your irrigation water, and what type of soluble salts the water contains. Citrus leaves are very efficient in their capability of absorbing soluble salts that are dissolved in residential water. Repeated washings that occur in a close period of time can completely defoliate a tree. A friend of mine hosed his trees down every morning trying to get control of an huge aphid infestation in his greenhouse. After a week of doing this the leaves begun to show signs of toxicity, and to shed its leaves over the next couple weeks. This happened on 14 of his containerized citrus trees. Four or five of the trees (no not really sure of the count) never regrew new foliage and died due to salt toxicity. If you look on Purdue University's web site you can read their caution about spraying residential water on citrus foliage. - Millet
Very interesting Millet! I never would have thought. And Krx, I don't really mean to say you have a root problem. I was suggesting that it is a good idea to let the soil get reasonably dry between waterings so the roots don't start to decay. And not just the top but all the way down. Continuous wet soil can cause the leaves to become a bit deformed and some to fall off easily. I just didn't recognize any common Mite damage from the pics and thought I would mention about watering. I have no idea where Latvia even is to comment on the amount of sunlight or temps you get in the winter. Those also play a factor in the amount of water a plant uses or needs. As for wiping the plants clean it may be a good idea to read Millets suggested website. Best of luck, Jim.
Latvia is in Eastern Europe, near to Scandinavian countries. Right now temp is about 0 C. As I mentioned before, there isn't much sunlight right now. Today my tree dropped 5 of his leaves and now I'm really thinking about the root problem. As I mentioned in my first post here, I've got my tree for 2 months now and at the beginning I was overwatering it for about 1 week, while I found out how citrus should be watered. After overwatering my tree for this 1 week I didn't spot any deformed leaves or any other damage (except leaves were dropping, but, as I said, i think it was because of closeness to radiator). So I assumed that my terrible mistake hadn't damaged the roots. Right now I'm doubting it.. I can't find a reason for leaves to drop. Can it really be root rot developed in this 1 week of overwatering?
The 2 main reasons for leaf drop are from exposure to sun while the roots are cold and overwatering. If the roots are left in soggy wet soil for just a few days it can damage the roots--citrus roots must have air. By any chance did you have a saucer under the pot to retain the excess water? Has the tree been exposed to direct sunlight? Skeet
I know where Latvia is. In fact we have a Latvian basketball player that is currently playing for the Denver Nuggets of the NBA. His name is Linas Kleiza. A very good player. The average life span for a containerized citrus tree is normally one to two years before something goes wrong and the tree dies. For many people that is the end of their citrus growing experience, however, other people do not give up and continually try their best to learn more and more concerning the cultivation of container grown citrus. Krx, you already have a much greater knowledge of how to properly take care of a citrus tree than when you purchased your first tree. Just about every new grower, and advanced growers experience the common problem of leaf drop. Leaf drop, and be greatly reduced, by watering correctly, providing a growth medium that maintains excellent drainage, keeping the temperature of the tree's foliage and the tree's root zone in balance, regularly inspecting for disease and insects, providing proper nourishment, plus insuring adequate light and humidity. You are already getting a grasp on many of these requirements. Keep up the learning and good work. Success will surely be achieved. Take care. - Millet
thanks for the comments. Skeet, yes I have/had the saucer. Tree hasn't been exposed to direct sunlight. That's why I'm thinking that most likely the problem is with roots. I'm going to check if it's not the root rot. Millet, thank you for your words. This citrus tree is my first attempt in gardening and I hope I can still save it. And Linas is from Lithuania, our neighboring country. We're very often mixed up by foreigners :) . Latvia hasn't got many good basketball players (just one in NBA, Andris Biedrins plays for Goldenstate Warriors) but we have many excellent hockey players. Our famous, defenceman Sandis Ozolinsh played 5 seasons for Colorado Avalanche and helped them to win Stanley Cup in 95/96 season.
The saucer could have held water on the roots long enough to cause damage. If you have to use a saucer try to find a way to elevate the pot in the saucer (put some kind of feet under the pot to keep it out of the water). Skeet
Krx, keep us advised how your tree is doing. I am a BIG Colorado Avalanche hockey fan. Over the years I have watched Sandis Ozolinsh play many many games. He was an exciting and a strong hockey player. If you have any more players like Sandis, please send them our way. I follow the Colorado Avalanche closely. The Avalanche hockey rink (The Pepsi Center) is only 30 minutes from my house. Take care and the very best of luck. Nice seeing your postings, - Millet
My tree is not doing any well. Many leaves (mostly the ones at the bottom of tree, closest to the roots) started to look sapless, just like they were wilting. Yesterday I took the tree out of the pot to check the roots. All the roots looked pretty light and firm, no sign of rot. Then I repotted my tree in a fresh soil and gave it a good watering. The reason of leaves wilting is because the roots aren't working properly, right? What else could I do to save my tree if it's not too late?
Possibly it has been a combination of things, including a little bit of over watering and being it is winter that has caused some leaves to drop. And the leaves that were just barely holding on fell off after a bit of rough housing while checking the roots? Does this mean your Citrus is dying, I really have no idea. If you keep it as warm as room temp., and allow it as much light as possible, and water properly, what more could you do? I am not a Citrus expert or have ever even grown one. I am sure as soon as the light gets a bit longer it will start to grow some new leaves. It must be somewhat normal for this type of plant in your area during the winter to show some signs of stress. But I think for you to assume we are pin pointing the problem exactly to the roots would not be correct. But I will talk to my Prayer plant to put a good word in for your beautiful little Citrus over there in Latvia! Best of luck Jim S.
It can take a while for damage to complete the process and cause a leaf to drop --often weeks after the event that caused it. Like Jimweed said the best you can do is give to proper care from this point on--citrus can pull through some pretty bad conditions. Can you post some new pics? Skeet
Krx, When a citrus tree is dropping leaves, it is generally "better" when it is leaves from the lower portion of the tree. As a citrus leaf ages, it's ability to supply energy to the tree diminishes as time passes. The lower leaves are generally, but not always, the tree's older mature leaves, therefore, it is possible the reason your tree is discarding the leaves is because they are nearing the end of their life span, and are no longer supplying more energy to the tree then the leaf uses. The life span of a citrus leaf is 18-24 months. Looking at the pictures you posted a while back your tree really did not look all that bad. Now that you have transplanted the tree, try to keep the root zone close to 70F - 80F (21-27C). A citrus leaf that is discarded due to age, generally begins to turn yellow in the lower center of the leaf. This yellowing slowly move up, until the leaf is discarded. The leaf also begins to have a dull look to it. - Millet
Thanks to you three for answers. Since I repotted my tree no leaves have fallen off so far. I guess it's a good sign. Jim, yes, the tree dropped 3 leaves fell off when I was repotting/checking the roots (one of them looked pretty healthy, two others were deformed). And thanks for the talk with your Prayer plant, my tree certainly appreciates it :) Millet, the leaves aren't turning yellow. They are just looking like they were wilting, like they don't have enough moisture and they are not so thick and fleshy any more, they are turning thiner. The root zone temp is about 19-20C right now. How can I boost it up? Here are the pics, Skeet. The first and the third ones are pictures of my wilting leaves.
