Here are pics of the problematic Black Bamboo

Discussion in 'Poaceae' started by vicarious1, May 11, 2009.

  1. vicarious1

    vicarious1 Active Member

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    Here are the pics and the obvious reasons why I want to keep the taller branches along the fence in the planters the shorter ones near the deck with pool chairs I don't mind them being shorter if needed. But as I said in the moment MOST are rolled up.
    The position/sun exposure of the planters is similar to the one where I go them from .Between two homes 2 houses down my road like 50m so same climate same sun side we are only like 10m higher on the hill. The ones in front of the terraced front wall is more exposed..Bizarre 1/2 of one branch survived 100% the rest of the leaves are rolled up.
    Lucky its raining since last night keeping the leafes moist. You can see the average size of each root ball. The round pots are NOT fully filled with earth there is a vertical pipe with drainholes on the bottom. The two on the arches have each one their root in a sunken pot on each side.
     

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    Last edited: May 11, 2009
  2. Ron B

    Ron B Esteemed Contributor 10 Years

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    They don't take having the roots exposed to air very well.
     
  3. vicarious1

    vicarious1 Active Member

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    this picture is one branch I did not plant as it had no leaves at all . It was only to show the size. All others were planted within hours and rested in very thick water with soil( mud like mixture while awaiting replanting. Thank you so much for your inputs.
     
  4. bambooman

    bambooman Member

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    Bambooman Here If you have phyllostachys Nigra it is getting way too much sun. Nigra needs almost full shade to get established. I made the same mistake. Nigra is a runner. But will not tolerate full sun when getting established. Try phyllostachys bissetti or p. aureosulcata. Its not black but will tolerate full sun and is very hardy. If you really want black bamboo you could try bambusa lako, but it is a clumper and will not spread to make privacy. Thanks
     
  5. woodschmoe

    woodschmoe Active Member 10 Years

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    The bamboo planted along the stone wall needs to be removed from it's far too small one gallon pot: even in shady conditions, a bamboo of that size in a small pot will constantly dry out. The leaf curling is a typical drought response, the plant curls its leaves to reduce moisture loss. The location in the picture presents an almost arid environment, against a south facing stone wall. The clay pot with the narrow neck will also be a problem, and the bamboo will become impossible to remove as the rhizome expands. P. Nigra appreciates some shade, as mentioned. The most important thing with bamboo is mulch: after removing the plant from its pot and gently spreading the rhizome out (if possible), you must provide a solid top layer of mulch, wood chips/shredded bark will do. If you insist on growing bamboo against the wall, you will need to provide irrigation along with mulch, particularily when it's shooting.
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2009
  6. vicarious1

    vicarious1 Active Member

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    Hello thank you for your very interesting comments.
    As I explained beside the two in front of the wall ..the position light etc is exact the same as where I got it from 2 houses down the road. In Vancouver a Bambou say 5 feet tall ONE BRANCH cost in any nursery 50$ UP . So imagine
    what is the value of what I got for free. I don't have the $ to go shopping for bamboo. So want to make the best of it so will revise the positioning and pots this week end ...I still don't know what the RHIZOMES are .. I only got roots
    and smaller feeders like the one picture. The ticker ones that look like bamboo shaped roots were IMPOSSIBLE to remove they were entangles between rocks and under a concrete pavement.
     
  7. vicarious1

    vicarious1 Active Member

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    The pots in front of the wall are 2 feet deep..But will change them again to bigger ones. The clay pot has a vertical TUBE inside that holds the roots of the bamboo. So will remove them and put in all the BIG planters. Maybe just keep ONE branch for the look ..I do WATER MY GARDEN regulary as I work from home. Bizarre where they were before there was basically no earth what so ever they were entangles between rocks and a broken concrete path. But I will amend and try to do what you advise bigger pots etc or simply take it out the pot as it can't run anywhere but forward what I don't mind ...actually I should not have put a pot at all. Thank you so much for your advise ...
    This morning it had rained since last night and this morning most leaves were much more green again this afternoon dryinsh again. I wanted to ask.. Can a Bamboo REGROW new leaves on an existing stem if the old ones dye or only on new shoots ? I am just concerned all the work may end up with nothing... but dead branches ..
    NOW I am very concerned to RE disturb them again but if its for the better I sure will give it a try. Bye for now
    My love for flowers and plants can be seen on my photos at www.visualsenses.smugmug.com
     
  8. woodschmoe

    woodschmoe Active Member 10 Years

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    Bamboo is shallow rooted, so lateral space is more important than depth. The rhizome (the underground running part) will simply coil around within the pot space. A portion may eventually find it's way out the bottom of the pot and to the surface, but the potbound mass will likely dry up and die before that occurs, as the majority of shoots will simply head for the surface of the pot. P. nigra can grow in full sun; it also tolerates dappled light, and though it's a matter of opinion, I think it looks best in such conditions. The pieces that were growing under concrete and amongst rocks were rhizome: what you've divided, in your photo, is the rooted portion of the culm which attaches to the rhizome at the base. Bamboo sheds and renews its leaves in the spring. In this case, however, I suspect you've failed to dig enough rhizome to support the culm, and the leaf drop/dieback you're witnessing is merely the first stage of an overall decline. Still, in case you've managed to get some rhizome with the other pieces, replant out of the pots, mulch, keep from drying out, and see what happens.
     
  9. vicarious1

    vicarious1 Active Member

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    Hello Thsnk you so much . Yes I gather that maybe I don't have enough of the rhizome ( stupid me I snipped some off as to ease the planting in the pots. Anyway..I took the ones in front of the wall out of the pots and replanted within seconds in earth GOD LET IT RUN why not......:-) They are planted exactly 1 foot off the water drain from the higher level terrace.. It has stopped raining yesterday when I dug there today the earth was VERY VERY wet ..I watered on top till there was a lake and created a little wall around like for my rubarb.
    Then I move the talled and sole that survived perfect and put it in one of the BIG planter. Tomorrow morning will remove the ones from the BIG round pots and plant in the two other big planters and PRAY A LOT..
    Each time it rained the leaves seem to revive within an hour...so there must still be some life in there ...Let hope for the best... THANK YOU ALL FOR YOUR SUPPORT and very helpful advice! Such a great Forum..
     
  10. bambooman

    bambooman Member

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    First off Let's get you aquainted with what an actual rhizome is The rhizome portion is not like the feeder roots. it's actuallly like an underground bamboo cane. The feeder roots are completely different. The canes that you dug up need not only the feeder roots but they also need about 1 ft long of rhizome if at anytime the canes breaks from the rhizome it is toast. So you have to be very careful to keep from breaking it away from it's rhizome, the best way to accomplish this is by getting as big a rootball as you possibly can. It can usually handle losing some feeder roots but if it loses it's rhizome it's for sure a goner. One way of assuring you get enough rhizome is to take divisions of 2 or more canes the more canes the better the chance for survival. And even if it get's the same amount of sun as the parent grove, you have still set it back by digging it up from the mother plant(grove) so it will still require less sun to get it established. Trust me all of my small bamboos suffer in full sun until they get their own grove established even those that require full sun, because they have been cut back and they can't retain the amount of water that they once could. I hope this helps you. It has been my experience that black bamboo is the hardest for me to get established. But all of my other 14 species are doing great. I have only been growing bamboo for about 8 years but I have definetly learned a few things. Thanks and good luck. bambooman
     
  11. vicarious1

    vicarious1 Active Member

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    Thank you so much.
    Well I guess as you say TOAST... I thought the rizhomes are other roots to the next so I cut most off :-(...
    As there isn't any other there to take I have no choice but to live with the few that seem to have some life in them.
    ONly ONE 6m is doing 100% fine than there are 2 other 6m one that seem to have some green left in them.
    NOW I know. I have transplanted all into earth or VERY large pots with coconut fibre mulch etc etc...anyway..
    time will tell in moment I can't bring it to myself to cut all the ones that don't look too good. Still hoping that some will take a turn for the better or grow some new leaves. Most ryshomes were under concrete along a path as that is where my neighbour wanted them away... I went in with a stainles steel shovel NOT SOFTELEY as all was hard as rock some toom me 4hrs to get them loose..Thanks for your advise Well I guess the one 6m will have to keep me happy. 14 species I AM JALEOUS
    I lived 20 years in Hong Kong and China and just adore Bamboo.. Snif snif :-((((
     
  12. bambooman

    bambooman Member

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    Don't give up. All is not lost. There is always craigslist.org, many, many people despise this plant, although I can't understand why. Craigslist in your local area there are always people who want to sell bamboo for cheap or even sometimes free. You may have to do the digging yourself, but if you love this plant as I do you will not mind digging it yourself. Only now you know what to get, as large a rootball as you can possibly move. Bamboo likes to grow and spread, so it does best when unrestrained by a pot, don't get me wrong bamboo will grow in pots. Just won't grow to it's full potential. I have been growing in pots for 4 years outside all winter and I'm in zone 6b. You just need to heal it in, and by that I mean surround the pot with an insulator such as mulch, styrofoam, rock, bubble wrap or any other insulation that will stop the pot from freezing solid and you will most assuredly be successfull. For putting bamboo in pots it is best to start out with small plants so you can get alot of rhizome and the smaller the rhizome the more flexible it is. Plus when you buy off of craigslist you will not pay the outrageous prices that most bamboo nurseries charge. Just always keep in mind that not everyone knows about the rhizomes, a long rhizome is essential to your growing success. Each rhizome has growth buds each bud has the potential to be either a cane or another rhizome so you will want to get as many buds as possible and there is only one to each node or section, Just like on the canes where branches come out. Once you understand how it grows it all makes perfect sense. If you have any more questions you can email me and I'll be glad to help. jeff.gabelman@yahoo.com Thanks for reading and I hope you don't give up on this magnificent plant, but beware you will become addicted.
     
  13. JCardina

    JCardina Active Member

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    I read through this and two things came to mind:

    1) I have Ph. Nigra growing in full sun and it's just fine, probably because in our area (yours and mine) full sun means nothing like it would mean further south, i.e. in many parts of the U.S. However, I've never heard of any issues with any Phyllostachys requiring shade anywhere, generally the only varieties that are shade loving are supposed to be some Fargesias etc, but in reality, in our climate, I've yet to see any bamboos do better in shade than in our "full sun" and I have dozens of different cultivars growing in both shade and full sun and the ones recommended for shade are doing far better in the full sun. A *lot* of the info you read about bamboo comes from sources that intended that info for their own area which is typically much sunnier and hotter areas than ours and most of it is bogus for our area. Even when info is specifically for the Pacific Northwest, we're the North in PNW related info you typically see and much cooler still.

    2) Whenever I've read about taking a division people almost always state that the culms should be topped as much as 2/3 to compensate for the reduction in roots. Because there are less roots when you divide the plant can't keep all those leaves moist like it used to so you top it and leave far less and it won't stress the plant trying to keep up with evaporation.
     
  14. JCardina

    JCardina Active Member

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    Bambusa's won't grow here reliably, far too cold. You have to keep in mind the location of people posting relative to your own, the conditions here are almost completely different from Kentucky
     
  15. vicarious1

    vicarious1 Active Member

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    Hello.
    Yes what I forgot to say also that the one standing along the stone wall has a big tree in the front so only gets FULL sun from like +- 1pm onwards and then after 3 sort of gets some shade fromr the second tree in the street and the opposite for the other ones. I would like to re iterate I can NOT afford to go out an buy any Bamboo at 75 $ for a 1-2m meager shoot in some nursery. Why did I atttempt this transplant "from heaven" is because it was offered to me FOR FREE from a "kind"neighbor.....who did not want to digg and hates gardening and me doing the job of clearing his path next to his house 30m from here was a good give and take. For me 6m branches was like a dream..so no point telling me what I "could" get.. Anyone out there who in in Vancouver who could spare some other Bamboo that NOW I would cut with more knowledge about the Rhizomes etc ?
    Dear JCardina .. sad you live you live so far away on the Island. I would love to see your Bamboo and get a few nice branches:-)...I have but MULCH over all of them ..and water them heavily since day two.
    PS: I still would like to thank anyone from anywhere who answers questions/problems your time is much apreciated and together with some local help I start understanding how to balance and take in the information.
    To me still a mistery the shedding of the leaves...I pray it still could happen to my beautiful branches. Bizarre somehave green leaves 1/4 way up and then the rest is looking totally dry. Are ther different moisture conducts inside one big branche?.. When I moisten intensively with my waterhose the leaves turn greenish again within minutes ..so I wonder who dead they are ? They SOUND 100% dry when the wind blows and then they soften up.. I guess somehow I have to ask a PANDA:-).
     
  16. bambooman

    bambooman Member

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    I think some people misunderstood what I said or maybe it was the way I said it but what I actually meant was if you take a division of bamboo freshly dug and you put it out in the blistering sun it will have major water loss now if you take that same division and put it in the shade until it recovers it will do just fine with not much water loss. That is why I suggested putting it in the shade and letting it grow to the sunny spots. All still depending on getting a large piece of rhizome with canes attached. Thanks for the nice comments and I hope you have a better understanding of this magnificent plant. All ideas have some truth to them depending on climates and growing conditions which we all know can be completely different in your next door neighbors yard. Not just other regions. Thanks again hope this helps.
     
  17. vicarious1

    vicarious1 Active Member

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    Thank's for your comments and concern. By now I managed to grow 80% of them to up to 4m tall and the have many new shoots the ones who did not make it I just cut them down but they shot again new babies. Now I will see. Will they survive as well as the neighbors where they come from.
     
  18. bambooman

    bambooman Member

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    That's great to hear, sounds like you're well on your way to a real nice grove. Have you tried any others yet? If they shot new shoots your success rate sounds great. I wish I was as fortunate I've bought 3 pots of phyllostachys nigra and all have failed while others 3 ft away are thriving and my other 18 species are doing great as well. But I will not give up on this species I just need to find a new source. Anyway, enjoy your nigra and happy bambooing.
     
  19. vicarious1

    vicarious1 Active Member

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    Here a few pics I am growing two branches in an arch over two benches and a dream catcher .. hope they will like to grow in that shape also :-) Best of luck I let you know how they are doing after the winter :-) that is NOT far away 66cm snow on the mountains just behind the house..
     

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  20. JCardina

    JCardina Active Member

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    Funky chairs Vicarious!
     
  21. vicarious1

    vicarious1 Active Member

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    Original 1970 Ferrari Italy been around the world with them. They are made fo Fiberglass the South African sunshine nearly discolored them pink. I just had them redone this year. They are the most comfortable pool chairs ever just mould perfect to any body shape and with drink platform on each side etc.. and stackable.. yeaah Italian Design
     
  22. thanrose

    thanrose Active Member

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    It's great to see some of your hard-won bamboo surviving, vicarious1.

    And I love those chairs, too.

    Good information here on bamboos, thanks to all.

    Bambooman has explained why some golden bamboo I transplanted years ago was doomed from the start. I knew enough to get some rhizome, a couple of culms, prune the canes back, water and mulch heavily, and provide temporary shifting shade until established, but I just didn't go far enough with getting the rhizome. Probably only had a hands breadth.
     
  23. bambooman

    bambooman Member

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    Vicarious1 Well it's been a year now. How's the new P. Nigra doing? I am up to 28 species of bamboo and still climbing. From your last post the nigra seemed to be doing well. I have aquired another small nigra that looks pretty good although it's on 1 ft tall. You should by now have the makings of a nice little grove. Have you gotten any other species? Around about late march maybe april you should start looking for new shoots. Once you find them you can mark them so you won't step on them. If any have grown out where you don't want them let them grow out and get their leaves and branches. After they have done this they can be dug up leaving them attached to the mother then bend them around and put back into the grove. This will train your boo to grow where you want it to. And the plants will not suffer transplant shock if left attached to the mother. Now the rhizomes will usually run the same directions as the branches. There will be one on each side of the plant. Dig up the whole rhizome with canes attached and bend it into a area and replant water well. Try to leave as much soil around the rhizome as possible to prevent drying out. Good luck
     
  24. vicarious1

    vicarious1 Active Member

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    Hello. This is so nice of you to recall my bamboo after such a long time. I have had a great year and have many new shoots up to 3-4 meters tall. I grow all my bamboo in 1x1x1m wooden planters so they won't run very far :-) as much as they like and there is plenty of space in the planters. Only issue maybe is the leaves of some branches the leaves has like spots that are sort of straight and lighter color. I have not gotten other types in the garden. But in the front along my 2.5m stone wall one neighbor gave me some that has green branches I mixed them with the black one who seem to have taken over. Funny there is another area where I wanted them to sort of grow wild along the side stone wall and buried a whole bunch of rhizomes and only one branch came out. I will make you some bamboo dedicated photos. There is one area i like a lot where I grow Bamboo in pots and made like an arch over two 70s antique Ferrari chairs by binding them together so it creates like a rainbow of bamboo in the middle I put a dead branch of a red maple garnished with sort of a crystals dream catcher ..( talk about kitch haha but it looks good and catches the morning sun in summer ... a summer that is unfortunately gone and was not so good and they talk about a mother of all autumns and winters . So we are left in fear again :-)
     
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  25. bambooman

    bambooman Member

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    vicarious, I'm glad to hear that you're having good luck with your bamboo. I too have now gotten some P. Nigra. It's been in the ground for about 8 months and I think this one is gonna make it. As far as having the lighter colored leaves they may either be new leaves that have just opened or they may be leaves that are about to be replaced. If they are sporadic on the plant, don't sweat it. Now if they are all yellowing at the same time then you may be overwatering or underwatering. But keep in mind at this time of the year many bamboos in my yard are going through a leaf change right now. So the leaves are sporadically falling off to be replaced. They first turn yellow and fall off when dryed out. Leave that space open for a new species. There are some really cool looking ones with stripes on them. P. Aureosulcata "Spectabilis", P. Vivax"Aureocaulis". You should go to some bamboo websites and check some of these out. Take care and good luck.
     

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